You are viewing a single comment's thread from:

RE: Can Hive scale under its current reward distribution mechanism to millions of users?

in Hive Improvement4 years ago

I think you are confused with some of the basic terms of this blockchain and it should not be the case with someone who is one of top 20 witness.

Proof-of-Brain was supposed to be manual human engagement but all you can see is curation sniping and automated votes.
If an account is manually voting then how can you say its a bot??
You do currently have 800k HP, why not make start making a difference yourself by manually voting yourself? I would say your voting pattern is similar to a bot because you mostly follow trails.

Only curation snipers are able to maximize their rewards and I think you know this better from Smartsteem days. By curating manually, you can just barely reach to break-even.

Why should anyone contribute and encourage curation sniping and automated effort by voting after them? Imagine If everyone start to do the exact same thing, things would be more worse. It is still better to promote newbies than to maximize rewards from popular authors, you know very well its easy to do so.

I think the main problem is automation(curation snipers who try to maximize their reward by voting at 3-4 minutes). Just try to ban automated votes and you'll see actual curation and more organic engagement. You might have noticed it in first two weeks when Hive was born. We all were able to see how popular authors were just like anyone else and organic votes were more real.

I see you have your own reason to follow some good trails and you are not one of the curation snipers but there are some people in top 20 who only curation snipe all day and just maximize their rewards on personal account by delegated stake, which the main problem.

Sort:  

I'm new and cryptomonies in a decentralized network is not my forte, I come from a centralized system... There are many things I don't understand well, they talk about how to lift the coin and the leeches in the pool... and they criticize you for curing the content of new users, right? But I arrived four months ago I discovered myself as an artist because you saw something in my content that nobody else saw.

So I'm wondering, how do you see the real talent in the garbage if you just follow a healing path and do an automatic voting cure? I receive an automatic vote and I think that whoever gives it to me has never seen my content, they don't know if it is valuable or rubbish.

Second, we need big investors, but how do we attract them if we are a community without many users?

How do we position a currency that nobody uses?

It is my humble opinion, that I am a very small fish in this net.

So I'm wondering, how do you see the real talent in the garbage if you just follow a healing path and do an automatic voting cure? I receive an automatic vote and I think that whoever gives it to me has never seen my content, they don't know if it is valuable or rubbish.

Exactly!

Second, we need big investors, but how do we attract them if we are a community without many users?
How do we position a currency that nobody uses?

Hive will be used, we don't need a global reward pool for that. (https://peakd.com/hive/@blocktrades/hive-s-future-as-a-2nd-layer-blockchain-network)

I wasn't confused and meant what I said. Thanks.

No one is interested in fixing the complex curation curve while every one knows it is broke.
What give me more pain is business ideas like reward.app. If witness want to promote their own business instead of fixing a broke thing then whole debate of Hive improvement is just a lie.

Ofcourse no one wants to talk about Bid-Bot 2.0 and it shows their commitment to 'Content Discovery', which many people wanted to address before

What do you mean by "By curating manually, you can just barely reach to break-even."

To break even with what?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought that (at least when one's HP reaches orca territory) that the curation in absolute terms is still fairly large, even if it could be much better with "curation sniping".

Everyone likes to accuse us of maximizing curation rewards but facts are different. They are normally talking about APR or average efficiency according to effective HP, so accordingly efficiency applies the same way on Orca or Whale.

Consider these facts from Hivestats as an example:

1.jpg

100% efficiency means you are not losing or gaining anything according to your effective SP. Less than 100 means you are losing something.
To achieve more than 100, it is only possible via curation sniping(automated votes within first 3-4 minutes).

Its easier to gain more efficiency by choosing popular authors and it takes considerably less effort than voting manually. By choosing to do curation sniping, you can just sit back, relax and criticize all day long.

thanks for pointing this out, but I still don't quite get it 😅 (which is a bit embarrassing for being here for almost 3 years)...

"100% efficiency means you are not losing or gaining anything according to your effective SP."

I assume this refers to the inflation that we are all subjected to? If my APR is under 100%, then my staked HP loses voting power as the inflation is higher than the growth of my stake? Is this correct?

If so, then this isn't necessarily so problematic as:

  • I might still earn that difference in form of author rewards, growing my stake (if powered up)

  • If you are an orca or whale it just means that your voting power will decrease perhaps by as much as 4% annually (see the quote from @grampo). But in absolute terms you are still making tons of Hive (even in 5 years (which would then be about 17% less, in fact this decrease gets slower as the years go by)). Granted, you have to be an orca or higher for this not to bother you...

In fact, I think especially the last point (if correct) should be a huge motivation for large stakeholders to vote more freely. Of course there is the human need for more (greed) which mitigates this, but still; speaking for myself, if I ever reach 100k, I wouldn't be bothered by this so much (I hope ;)

If this analysis is correct, then the biggest problem from this would be that it starkly favors larger stakeholders as especially newcommers would have to maximize their APR to "catch up". Something that should be addressed, otherwise Hive is likely never able to retain its users. Although this problem is limited to the curation side of things.

Its an estimate of upcoming pending rewards of one week and does not refer to inflation

All the people who are mostly criticizing are whales and you might see the same people spreading misinformation intentionally. It does not bother me at all and it reminds me of this quote:

You will never reach your destination if you stop and throw stones at every dog that barks.
― Winston S. Churchill

You're comparing your efficiency with one of the most efficient curators on Hive, and even 96% is extremely efficient. You're only able to achieve that level since you're voting on fresh content; aka content where no other stakeholders have voted on before. I'm open to being proven wrong tho'.

And by the way, I'm obviously following curation trails. Who has time to manually curate while losing out massively vs auto-voters? Unless of course, you set up your own community and vote on fresh content.

I already stated the 'why' of it earlier and I don't need to prove anything wrong. Thanks.