Hello, SPIer's. For anyone that has been around SPI for some time, you'll be aware we're always asking for people to come and join us. Nobody ever steps up, everyone says they would love to help but dont have the time or can't think how they can help. Nothing wrong with that, we all have lives and im not involved with most of my investments, I just what them to go up in value. But look, half the content team is not posting anymore, they stopped writing without even a warning. This is ok and I see that SPI needs to be remodelled and updated which will all happen within the next few months. There are a few things to go over and instead of writing 1 huge 5000-word post with everything in 1 place, I have decided to break it up and focus on each thing with its own post.
Going forward, I see my role as managing funds, people and launching a new project under SPinvest every 6 months. I have already stepped away from producing consistent content im posting maybe 3 times every 2 weeks. The SPI fund is sitting on good profits, it's time to add more structure and professionalism. SPI is already in my view the best of a bad bunch when it comes to investment tokens on HIVE, we are the most transparent, we dont prop the token price up with paper profits, we offer a buy-back which nobody else does and I think the reputation build over the past 30 months as a project that only releases asset-backed subprojects adds unlimited value. I would bet my last penny that more users on HIVE will not have heard of SPinvest before. Im ok with this because the token is hard-capped already so I have nothing to sell (for now) and fewer people in my view means I can have a bigger impact on those that are invested already. The idea of making 30-50 people that believed in me alot of money long term compared to making 500+ people that bought in cause it's "popular" a small bit of money sounds much better. I'd be happy either way but from the get-go, I always said view SPI as a long term fund and that investing $20 will get you nowhere. You give SPI $20 and get back $200 in 10 years, big whoop!! Give me $2000 and I give you back $20k, now we're talking. I understand the return is the same, I just mean dont view SPI as something that you put $20 on as a gamble, this is not what SPI is. Those that saw that when first launched are sitting on massive gains already.
Please see the topics I will cover over the next few weeks below. Each topic/plan will be introduced 3-4 weeks after one another to ensure we can focus on 1 thing at a time while promoting the next. These posts over the next few weeks are my idea's and plans. I would like some feedback if possible please so I can fine-tune the plans and aim to please the majority of investors. After that, we start to introduce them 3-4 weeks apart.
- Introducing incentives
- Changing Dividends back to HIVE
- Changing the current Partnership Agreement to Terms and Conditions
- Exploring the idea's for new SPI tokenomics (if even required)
- Beneficiaries and Custodian's
- Investor trading contests
Introducing incentives
We will start by looking at beginning to compensate people that post content, run accounts and offer profit shares to people that manage wallets/funds for us. SPI has grown as much as it's going to with the number of people contributing, the only way for us to expand is to introduce incentives and hope new people join. People like jk6276, shitsignals, city-of-dresden and shanibeer for EDS are hard to come by. Others were committed in the past but no longer have the time I guess, maybe this could bring them back. Let's start to get daily posts out again, fund and help people launch projects/wallets and grow our HIVE income. I believe spending some will earn alot, not a massive number but if we could get back to 800-1000 HIVE per week, I'd be happy with that.
How to fund it?
At the start, incentives would be paid out in SPI tokens because we hold alot of our own tokens at the minute and we need some time to build our income again before we can reward in HIVE. I would guess that we have at least 20 weeks worth of rewards based on 10 posts per week and 3 people managing wallets. I will continue to buy back SPI's if i see them priced at 80% are lower to drag the process out a little but there will come a time when incentives will be paid in HIVE. Could be 6 months, 1 year or 16.3 years. I like the idea of the last SPI we hold going to ones that are actively taking part.
So we can freeroll (sort of) the first 20 weeks. After that, we hope any boost in income either covers it or gets close. The SPI's held by SPinvest when paid out will not liquidate anyone's position. The tokens held by SPinvest are already priced in as they were bought from the exchange. We own those SPI tokens the same way an investor would and paying out SPI's as incentives is simply a transfer from 1 wallet to another. Well, there is 1 difference for spinvest holding SPI's, I blacklisted spinvest from receiving dividends. When I can no longer buy back SPI's at 80% from the market and our supply drops to only a few hundred tokens, we will convert incentives payouts to HIVE.
When we convert from SPI's to HIVE as incentives, the payouts will be restructured based on what's happening at that point. This means, if we say 5 SPI for 1 post in SPI's, that does not nessacarly mean that it'll be equivalent in HIVE. In 6-12 months, everything will be different in regards to crypto prices, our holdings and our earnings so I can't predict what the incentives will be valued in HIVE at that time. I'd rather say, we'll figure it out when we need to instead of throwing a number out there and having to commit to it and then looking like a fool when we have to change it when the time comes. When the time comes, most likely, I'll create a group chat on discord and we'll hold a meeting between anyone receiving incentives at that time.
What will the incentives be?
I have thought about this long and hard because I dont wanna payout too much but it needs to be enough to keep contributors from leaving. I have ended up with 3 grades of incentives. Posting content, running an account under SPinvest and a profit share for these that manage funds. The first 2 are paid out in SPI's and profit shares are paid from profits.
Producing Content - 5 SPI per post
This would be 50 per week if SPinvest were uploading daily, Eddie-earner x2 per week and spinvest-leo x1 per week. Currently, it would cost us 25 SPI per week with 5 posts over 3 accounts. FYI, we might pay more for video content.
Running an account - 10 SPI per week
Currently, we have 3 people running 4 accounts for us so that would be 40 SPI per week. We will have more people in the future, im sure of it but for now, it's 40 SPI per week.
Profit Share
This one is tricky. First off, this would be funded from profits so no SPI's will be going toward profit-sharing rewards. I run a few numbers and have come to the thought that 20% of anything transferred backed to spinvest is fair. I had actually written 15% when I first wrote this around a week back but since thought that 20% is better even if it costs SPI an extra 5%, I think it's still worth it for SPI to have those funds at risk for the payback and growth on those wallets.
I had thought about paying out profits shares based on performance and making payments every 6 or 12 months but decided that payouts should be based on cashed out profits. With gaming, for example, you can 10x your investment but you cant see that profit as it's mostly paper profit. So as an example we invest 1000 HIVE, it's worth 10,000 HIVE 1 year later but we might be able to sell it for 5000 HIVE max and we'd need to pay out 1800 HIVE to the operator based on the paper profit. Paying out on HIVE/HBD sent back to spinvest makes much more sense I think as it's 100% solid money and also after the initial investment is recouped of course.
We could set this up on a levelling up tier thing where the % of reward increase's as higher profits are made but to keep it simple, maybe 1 rate fits all would work best for us. FYI, SSUK is excluded from this as I have no idea how to work it out based on the number of funds I hold compared to others that manage funds. I feel like it's not for me to decide how to pay myself if that makes sense.
As it stands, im think offering 20% is is better than offering 15% and I dont want us to pay 25% so 20 is plenty of incentive.
That's it roughly in a nutshell
The bottom line is this will cost roughly 100 SPI tokens per week but I hope that our income will grow along with that. Only time will tell but I have an idea to get new people onboard as traders through a contest. There will be a big risk/reward ratio with this but it will create some hype and the prizes to the winners will be most likely be in the hundreds and maybe thousands of dollars along with the chance to continue on with SPI for weekly income and profit share. That's for another post but that's a snippet, as im sure a few were thinking "what's this contest thing" when you saw it above.
Let me know what you think about these numbers above for incentives to those that post content, run accounts and manage funds for us. If I had to put a date on when I plan to introduce this, I would guess the start of March. It's going to take a few weeks to get out the posts for the other topics and gather feedback and I think 1 month from now is doable. Might even have a week to promote the idea as well and try to get new content producers from the get-go. So there are 6 things listed above, you could call this our map road for the next 6 months with plans on trailing a loaning service mid-February for 4 months. Just testing everything works with converting tokens between each other and finishing off the posts required before launch. Introduction, terms, loan sample and launch. I currently have 1 done. ekk
So yes, let me know what you think about the numbers.
Work and added value deserves a fair return !!
Win win !!
So, I totally agree with this proposal and yes SSUK is also entitled to a share for his work!!!
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Let's hope it works and we can get our earning up again to boast div's a little.
Thank you for your feedback, sounds like your are cool with the idea's
Excellent idea! I hope that this incentives will restart the publishing team and would also try to contribute a bit more on spinvest-leo. I really hope that a kind of a club feeling is evolving or extending to more as the hand full of people that currently are actively involved. Lets give it a fresh re-start!
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Fingers crossed it works. We'll find out in a months when up and running at 100%
Thanks for your feedback
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He lost interest!!!! baaaa-hahaha
It would be fabulous if your smoky club idea for spinvest-leo got off the ground!
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Wouldn't it be fair to make the incentive in proportion to the content-payout? Like 50 % beneficiary or something like that?
So better content would be better profit for the writer.
Otherwise it could be the risk, that the incentive is higher than the post payout. Or did I understand this wrong?
Anyway big thanks for all your work!
20 % profit share is quite a lot. But I think it's fair.
Wouldn't mean profit, that the initial investment doesn't count? Otherwise any profit of less than 20 % would be a loss. If we invest 1,000 Hive and get 1,100 Hive back of that and we pay 220 Hive as profit share we would have only 880 Hive out of our initial 1,000 Hive. That wouldn't really make sense to me.
Well, we could do that!
When we run out of SPI's token and switch over to paying HIVE to content producers, there will be a discord meeting held to decide the new payouts. I'd guess it will be beneficiary based. Last paragraph of the "How we fund it" part.
20% is fair
Yep I wrote that wrong. The payout to the operator would be 1800 HIVE. Your last quote is only half the sentence, the second half is "I think as it's 100% solid money and also after the initial investment is recouped of course." I'll edit that number from 2000 to 1800.
Thanks for checking out the post, the beneficiary idea will be best.
very good points. I tried a 20% beneficiary system for guest-authors on spinvest-leo for some time without much success. It looked like this was not enough of an incentive (in addition to the reachout to new readers) for a prolonged engagement. The idea to grant SPI shares might be a better incentive for people who like to see the whole project flourish.
I agree 😎
Personally, I prefer the standard payment reward - pay outs are so variable and sometimes have very little to do with the content. It has taken over a year of posting every week to push up the payouts on the @eddie-earner account, regardless of a year of savings content and pretty much every week being in the top ten posts for engagement, often at number two. If the content producer has invested in SPI or EDS, they will benefit anyway from higher post payouts through increased token value and increased dividends ... we all win 😍
I'm not sure why this is an issue if all the SPI tokens are already sold and people aren't leaving in their droves.
I'm not sure why this is the case. From your post updates I thought it was working well from a 'get rich slowly' perspective.
However, rewarding people who are active in the management and growth of SPI seems like a good idea and, hopefully, those more economically savvy will make more useful contributions as to the "how" than I can.
Thanks as always for your work on this.
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It is working well but it could always be better. If SPI were to 5x from where is it today, I'd be able to make it my full-time job and then things would get done, done. Hard to get rich slow when we're compounding down at 20-30% each year. Defi was not really a thing when we first launched, Move up are get left behind they say.
Yeah, the "how" is the tricky bit.
Thank you for taking the time to read through the post
I think there is something about building the capacity and infrastructure of SPI to take advantage of new opportunities. One of the things I love about SPI is I don't have to worry about ETH and gas fees (or even if they are still a thing) or learning De-Fi and pools and diesel and impermanent losses or gaming (😱), someone else in the team knows/gets it and we all benefit.
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Can you elaborate a little more on what this entails? Of course if I have to ask I'm probably not qualified. ;)
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Currently, I run spinvest and eddie-earner. Shit-signals runs the gaming account spi-steemcity and JK is in charge of spinvest-leo.
I guess the main difference in running an account and managing a wallet is profits and where they come from. Content is not part of the profit share. You could as example create a HIVE newspaper account under SPinvest and post to it 2 times per week, have a weekend edition (Sat) and mid-week edition (Wednesday) where you report all the most up to date HIVE blockchain information. That new account would be under your management, I (SSUK) would never touch it.
If you had a good investment plan for a Non-hive holding (polycub as an example) and I agree it's a sound plan, SPI will provide capital to start. This would be managing a wallet and you would be entitled to a profit share.
Dont think you're not qualified. You do not know what you can and can't do till you try and none of us has tried everything. I hope this explains it a little better, if you have more questions, hit me up
Obviously, I'm a fan, and obviously biased as I would benefit from this.
Beyond that, however, incentives and rewards for those doing the work will boost participation, make contributing in various ways more appealing which should grow the investments and income over time. This benefits all holders, not just the ones actively participating.
You should be including yourself also SSUK, The funds you manage represent the bulk of SPI's assets and you should earn your 20% share for the management of that as I see it. Would be unfair if a situation arose where I received more for managing 1 account, producing 1 post per week, and a 20% share of a small portion of the weekly dividend funds (from @spinvest-leo activities) than you did for running 2 accounts, posting, and managing the majority of assets.
Overall, I'm a fan for more reasons than the obvious self interest.
Cheers mate,
JK.
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You've been pulling your weight the past 2 years as well man, the club idea was a nice idea but it's not working and paying out something is the next thing to try/do to get people involved.
Me taking 20% would be too big, I'd feel guilty taking that much plus im assuming it would be measured in HIVE value so my payment would be zero this year anyway as we've lost lots of HIVE value as it's gone from 20 cents to $1 this year so far. lol. Traditionally, a fund manager gets 2% of assets under management plus 20% of profits if there are any. Maybe I could explore a % of assets under management and make it once a year payday sorta thing. That might work best for us and be the most transparent and easiest way to do it.
Thanks for the feedback :)
Really interesting ideas and really good to see 😍.
I'd love to be working with other people on the @eddie-earner account. I'll include a link to this post in this week's Saturday Savers Club, we have a bigger pool of savers this year and some may be interested in helping with content - they definitely all want to save more!
Thats a cool idea, saving content would be popular with EDS, SPI and LBI token holders :)
As a top50 holder, closer to the $200 range rather than the $2000, I think that work shall be paid.
There are two ways to get paid in my opinion and UBI is not part of that. One is labour, what the team is doing here, and the other is investment. (There are social cases, where something bad happened to a person, where it needs help, but this is an exception to the rule)
Here different simulations need to be done, where to see if the motivation is enough by the incentives and how is this affecting the project.
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We'll get the ball rolling in 3-4 weeks and see how much engagement will receive and see if the incentives are enough to motivate users/token holders.
I haven't been following the fund progress recently. So not sure how much SPI holdings are. I need to check discord or latest post. I like the idea to incentivize team with SPI or shares. But 20% as a management fee is too much for an investor.
There is another point that to have targets/milestones and if team achieve that in the said timeframe they would get bonus shares/rewards instead of paying a high amount upfront. So instead if paying 100 SPI a week it can be 50 or 60 or whatever number is good to spend per week. and If we see the targeted growth in 3 month or 6 month timeframe, they would unlock those additional bonus tokens.
The 20% is not from our pocket, it's from cashed out profits, not total earning or growth. So if SS from the gaming account were to earn 300 HIVE in 1 week and decided to reinvest 200 HIVE and send 100 HIVE to spinvest, he'd get back 20 HIVE.
SPI's is mainly for content and im not sure how to set targets for content. I understand we could set targets for engagement, payouts but I also think that be a can of worms to figure out. What sort of targets were you thinking of?
Thanks for the feedback, you make some good points
Oh That makes sense. So it's 20% of the dividend income? IS there a number that how much %age of earnings go to profit/dividend over reinvesting?
Yeah, from HIVE earnings, its split 50/50 between dividends and growth and everything non HIVE is compounded for growth.
new to hive, new to spinvest. is there a beginner guide for this`? 🙃
Hello there, im new to Hive since last summer, came across your token and this post tonight, take a look at my posts and let me know if you would like to make an arrangement. I currently write about Splinterlands and Rising Star. Soon I will be adding dCROPS and dCITY to the periodic post list. Im also a well seasoned stock investor so I consider posting relating to that sometimes also. Let me know.
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