Note: this post isn't meant to put @ats-david on the spot nor be critical of his outlook on things. His sentiment is mirrored in a number of users within the slack so I figured rather than get berated for sharing my thoughts on the matter there I'd just post in the open public to maintain transparency.
The image above is a screenshot from the Hive slack in the #price room.. I found myself typing a long ass reply to @ats-david but rather than waste my time typing in there only to get scoffed at it was decided that I post my reply on the blockchain. While I can empathize with how he feels this was my response to his statement and question above...
My Response
I wouldn't say that the (HIVE) project has lost momentum.. Nor would I go as far as to say things are stagnant. The 15 minutes of fame are over from the steem split so it makes sense that we're no longer talk of the town. Hard fork is coming up. That is exciting progress and certainly helps distance HIVE from it's origin chain.. But then again we've got like 800 active users daily and only a tiny percentage of those are actively bringing in capital or use cases to HIVE. For HIVE price to increase it needs to attract capital and in order to do that it needs applications built on top of it that compel individuals from outside the current community to purchase HIVE in order to use / participate in said applications..
a screencap from https://hive-db.com showing posting reward totals for todayThe "shitposter" inflation giveaway (blog rewards) as far as I can tell is one of the few things attracting people to use HIVE, albeit it's attracting the types of users that tend to have little in terms of capital to invest, but what they do invest is time and sweat equity, which has varying value depending on who you ask.
I think we need to look beyond what the HIVE price is and focus on building things on top of HIVE that will ultimately give people a greater reason to get involved and purchase and HODL HIVE.
Yeah..Price sucks the past while, but looks like a lot of markets are tanking. Sitting around and pointing fingers at people and decreeing they are the bane of the HIVE market cap is fruitless at the end of the day. DPOS style coins like HIVE are always going to have inflation, that inflation is going to always end up in someone's pocket.. And thinking for a minute that taking a decent percentage of said inflation to dangle a carrot in front of people to potentially have them get involved in the community is some how a bad thing perplexes me. Hive needs use cases, users, broad market appeal and ultimately a plethora of solid fucking reasons (applications) to make it attractive to investor types.
This community has been around for a while.. The current blockchain not so much. The direction the chain decides to go ultimately relies on the larger stakeholders taking the reins and directing it towards a goal which sees not only userbase growth but also market cap growth. HIVE is fucking tiny right now both in userbase and price.. with the price being basically fucking irrelevant as long as we can afford to continue running the infrastructure to continue building upon it.
Go fourth and build a reason for HIVE to become big. Stop looking at the short term price and start looking to what you can do to help build a thriving ecosystem. At this point in time the crypto ecosystem is absolutely infatuated with stupid ERC-20 tokens, which is fine, it gives us as a community time to create things that will draw in new users an capital after the whole ETH token bubble goes tits up..
...
If you haven't already figured out this reply isn't exactly directed at @ats-david completely anymore, but rather at the community as a whole, to those lamenting that HIVE is dying, to those excited for the upcoming hardfork and to those who have no idea what the fuck is going on but are just along for the journey. We are HIVE. We are building. We will decide what fate the blockchain has in store.
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What I find interesting is how this 'talk' of destroying what Hive is and always was — in order to change it into something that appeals only to a tiny handful of people in society — that 'talk' has been around for awhile. Since it started, majority of the people left, enthusiasm is way down along with interest in the project and the price.
In four years, never once has this project been in a state where people with clout decide it's ready for mass adoption. It's almost as if the fear of success holds people back. Nobody expected this branch away from Steem. Nearly everyone expected the EIP hardfork to be the step before going mainstream; a way to clean up our act and be prepared to begin taking this project seriously, and to the next level.
Instead we're waiting for this next hardfork, which is necessary, but instead of planning to step it up to the next level, the talk once again is going backwards after what's next is said and done.
These people play this project like a lottery, waiting for this imaginary 'bull run', thinking, "If we just make our project just like the rest of the projects, we'll finally be interesting." There are no visionaries. Hardly anyone understands the value of entertainment and information. They only want to flip tokens for a profit, ditch the project, move on to the next, rinse and repeat. That's the mindset of the crypto dinosaurs for the past four years. Hardly anything that has value today will have value next year. Anything fashionable today will be yesterdays news in no time.
How has changing a few parameters worked in for us in the past? Well, we don't really know because each time something is changed, the platform isn't pushed out into the world. Instead, we're simply offered a new set of changes to "experiment" with; again and again and again.
Our content is a product we refuse to sell. This place has a severe shortage of content CONSUMERS, and that number has shrunk further since I left 3 months ago. Anywhere else on the internet, the content sells, and the consumers outnumber creators by a huge margin. There's always one act on the stage and thousands of butts in the seats. These consumers spend millions annually and you can see that money exchanging hands live by simply watching a stream on Youtube or Twitch. There's tremendous value in the written word and still images as well, especially when one creates a market for it. People will buy anything including tap water in a plastic bottle if it's marketed properly; but for some reason we make beneficial changes here and refuse to market the product. Creating demand for the token is as simple as realizing the entertainment and information is a product, then capturing some of the money already being spent on online content. That is a market worth billions annually and steadily growing.
No point in changing Hive into something that already exists because by the time those changes can go into effect, we'll be a year late and this tiny crypto crowd will have moved onto something else. Meanwhile entertainment and information has been around and going strong for centuries...
If you want a truck, buy a truck. Don't buy a car and convert it into a truck if you want a truck... because, what the fuck?
P.S. I ain't got time to proofread that shit...
I wish I had more upvotes to give.
The ones that are whining about shit aren't the ones doing anything in regards to being "movers and shakers"...
Personally I think the blogging and entertainment industry is going to be booming in the upcoming years. Although I would like to see an application come onto the network that makes blogging obsolete.
Totally agree with the experimental mention. It does feel like the community is a bunch of lab rats.
Highly appreciate the comment and what you've shared here.
Blogging needed to be reinvented. Less personal, more personality, more entertaining, creative, combined with solid imagery. Magazine-like articles still sell, both in paper and online and the blog needs to sway in that direction. Not many enjoy the social media style status update posts; only pervs and stalker types browse selfies, typically in secret, unless they're using a dating app. There are markets and there are consumers. People need to study both. This platform needs to drop the echo chamber stuff, hive this; hive that. Development news needs to be off in the corner, along with platform politics. Let the stuff that normally attracts eyes be seen. Lastly, allow the quality acts to be successful. The small town mentality has got to go. Who cares what your neighbor is doing; quit gawking over the fence. If they're not bringing your property value down and have the ability to attract investors/support, then celebrate it because that success is your success too, when you look at the entire picture instead of only the plate that sits in front of you.
As always there is some wisdom in your words, sad that you aren't listened by the ones who take decisions in this plattform, or they don't seem to care much about this issues or they're fine milking a system that benefits them.
I kind of agree with @ats-david, Hive inflation should be reduced (cut 20-25% from rewards, 30-50% from top 20 witnesses, remove DAO inflation, burn downvoted rewards, reduce power-down to 1 months (add an option for instant power-down, but 10% is burned )...). This could boost the Hive price.
P.S. Where could I get a Slack invite?
I can’t wait for Slack free HIVE
I like Transparency
How can we start some kind of community voting to change all of these things you just said?
The way to go about this would be to have a developer apply the changes to the source code.. then have 17 of the top 20 witnesses voted in running this new software.
Ultimately though we as small stake users don't really get to decide who is in top 20 unless by some miracle the weight of the small users votes is greater than the votes of larger stake accounts... But rather the first 10 pages of https://hive-db.com/accounts are the ones who votes land people in the consensus ranks.
and i am not really sure that small accounts would vote for another cut of 25% :)
and i am not really sure why a lot of people want to kill the only (if we don't count splinterlands) part of the blockchain that is making transactions and really keeping it alive in the public eye. i find it fascinating that a lot of people think that if you kill the social part of hive, everything will be great. but i know shit about crypto so i could be wrong.
Inclined to agree with you. It's absolutely deluded to think that by penalizing the small users blogging (who lets face it, make fuck all compared to decent ranked witnesses) it will some how increase the market cap.
The end user already took a 50% haircut on their post payouts to make whales feel like it's more worth it to hold HIVE for curation... Now there is musings of going even further with that.
It's almost like those proposing this type of shit are so far removed from reality and current global economic situation that they honestly believe that killing off the remaining users here will some how add a few cents to the HIVE price. lol
Do you really believe that people are not buying HIVE based upon the inflation?
What is the inflation rate of LEO? That took off in price yet has a much higher inflation rate than HIVE?
People are not buying HIVE due to the poor price action, which is partly related to the inflation levels, so to answer your question, yes.
I respect your thoughts on the matter. Hell I even respect Dave's thought on the matter to be fair. A removal of 25% of the author reward would leave them with what a 19% payout down from 50% pre curation amount increase?
It would be an interesting experiment to weed out who is here just for "shitposting" profits and who is here blogging for shits and giggles.
Uhm, If you've got an email you can PM me on discord I can try and get you an invite link sent. Although to be fair the admins of the slack are the ones who decide who gets an invite it looks like. Shoot me a message with your email on discord or something and we'll see if we can get you in.
An easier way to cut the inflation would to just accelerate the already build in reduction system. 0.1% every 250k blocks.
Yeah no shit eh?!
I am not part of this slack but I think finally @ats-david has a similar feeling like me since a while, a very long while.
Has no one finally seen that a blockchains known as a social media community that rewards content is simply not successful? Be it Hive (no. 149 on CMC), Steem (No. 127) or EOS' Voice? Or am just impatient and have to wait until ranking 500? Boring I say again we need business cases, brands that go here and use the chain - do we really need a community that gets rewards for engaging or can we just have a community that tries the chain because they are fans of the chain?
If you'd like an invite get ahold of me on discord and I can get your email for an invite. I understand where David is coming from but what it boils down to is that in the current state of the community and chain that inflation going to the 1000 or so users we have in the community is one of the few things keeping people around.
I completely agree with your sentiment that the chain needs more business cases. That ideal was the basis of a large portion of what was written. I'm not here blogging for a living. I'm building use cases and features that I hope will increase outsiders craving to come in with capital. I like this technology but for those that aren't coders the blogging is a way to be involved.
Sure, hit me anytime on Discord uwelang#9257
on the topic that not a lot is going on. HF is 2 weeks away, you can tip people with hive on youtube and twitter, hive overtook EOS and now is in the first place of blockchain games, leo is doing great, NTFShowroom is getting some traction (they also made massaging system that could be and probably will be implemented through hive ecosystem), we have a random guy who is playing games and he bought and powered up over 2.000.000 Hive, and i most probably missed shit tone of stuff here.
other problem is that most are in crypto to try and make crazy profits on weird named food tokens so all the attention is currently there.
Yeah.. People who side towards saying the community and development has been stagnant lately aren't paying attention to what is going on around them or ultimately just ignoring the progress going on to fit their narrative.
I don't get the whole shitcoin ERC-20 food token hype either.. Seems like a bunch of stupidity mixed with FOMO driving that.
Hive does have some issues with the way we are structured, namely the top having all power and the bottom still struggle ... as in any sort of class system. Those with power not wanting to give up power but consolidate it and increase their own holdings, while blaming the poor and wanting to take more from the poor.
I see this as a good old boys system. Where if you don't know the top 20 witnesses, it's going be very hard to get any proposals past and any progress made outside the agenda that the top 20 wish to have. People making money at the top don't want to do anything to shake the tree too much, so innovation get stagnant, projects get voted down, and things slowly stop. What also compounds this is that while I don't know a hundred percent, I expect a lot of people running the master nodes are just kids with very limited business experience, or more tech focused people and less business focused people.
Example a person with a good CEO background knows how to connect and make partnerships happen, how to streamline and grow an organization into a successful entity. Someone who just has money and slightly above average technology knowledge, can set up a master node and was able to buy a witness space earlier on, then hold onto that... this is not necessarily type of person who should be making business decisions. Sure, grateful for their investment but just because you have money and you can set up a witness server does not mean you have a business mind and you understand partnerships, growth, long-term vision and strategic planning. If anything it's the opposite, short-term profits, and limited vision.
In some ways it might be good if we had one company running everything so that there be a clear development path, we can build an advisory board, get shareholders who want to see the growth happen, have an actual marketing department....
I had a friend who submitted a marketing proposal after the split, however the majority of the witnesses ignored them, and the ones that didn't said they wanted them to work for several months for free, this was a pretty sizable PR company that was willing to do it supercheap, but they were sort of slapped in the face by what amounts to kids running a company.
I am bit bitter about that as I think we have so much potential here, but if we entrust the future to 20 people who don't necessarily have business experience just money to set up a server and have good old boy status with each other ... we are doomed to die.
again, I do love HIVE and have invested teh majority of my life savingings in to this platform.. for better or worse.. lol. Roll the Dice right?
Your mention of the good old boys club is bang on the money! Thank you for sharing your thought here. The classism is very real and those who are in positions of power tend to fight tooth and nail to keep said positions.
As for the whole situation it can be rectified but I'm almost entirely certain that those who are exiting will try and do as much damage on the way out as they can. Any FUD or drama that can be sparked will likely be grasped at but at the end of the day those whining and bitching about things are the same ones that generally are literally doing sweet fuck all towards improving the situation.
The proposal system is almost impossible for a newcoming developer or even an established developer on HIVE to get their proposal voted hard enough unless of course you've got the blessing of the HIVE bildeburgs.. And while a large percentage of the "elites" of HIVE are genuinely decent folks the problem is mixed within the elite ranks are sociopaths and drama queens.
The top 20 only include those tasks to running the network and its business side as long as they're in favour with those who own the most staek.. which ultimately is the ones that have been on the top forever.. The DPOS system by design seems to encourage groups of individuals keeping eachother in top witness spots over the community vote really deciding.
Buying HIVE as the price drops as the weak hands exit.. Honestly I'm excited for some of the bad seeds to leave and firesale their tokens while doing so sso they can be redistributed and ultimately end up in the hands of people more deserving.
What? You see the margins today? Well.... Yeah.
I'm watching. I'm learning. Got some time to spend getting this understood.
Bit right now we have a perfect chance to trade and teach others to as well. Our trading does affect price. As well as our value we put into here.
We are not dying. We are just beginning to grow. But the explosive swings have really set us up so that we are balanced in the teaching people how to trade and them actually getting to go somewhere.
Personally I'm seeing huge opportunities.
I've always sucked ass at trading but for those who have the brain for it these dips aren't a bad thing at all. Cheap HIVE has its advantages. Honestly not worried about the price personally.
We are just beginning to grow is a good sentiment, I view it in a similar fashion.
May this Hive continue to grow and expand
Exactly and when we get back to an a normal and regular economy without this huge depression I expect some amazing things to happen
When the price gets low people get crazy. Ironically though, when it gets high you never see the same people celebrating our amazing content creators. :OD
lol yeah no shit eh?
I like how amazing content creators is italicized. XD
Hehe, gotta keep it real after all :OD
Agree
Ps. I can’t wait for slack free HIVE
It's a decent repository for technical information as the majority of the individuals in there aren't dickheads.. But the ones who get off on trying to bring everyone else down to their level of misery make it toxic as fuck.
Technical information should be shared in layman’s terms with our community.
Transparency matters
For the most part I agree! However some things like potential security threats being found and patched should be kept off public forums until they can be patched so malicious actors don't use them.
BUIDLing Trust take years and I can certainly understand your view