On the risk of sounding too negative about things on Hive and how I'm starting my Youtube journey, I thought I'd upload another quick video with some thoughts after having a lengthy discussions regarding the delegation/token holdings for votes and other ways people may participate in these kind of schemes.
These thoughts are quite impromptu so there might be a lot of things I forgot to mention or potentially went too deep into discussing for too long, but do let me know what you think and if you maybe learned something new. Hopefully they're not teaching you how to "misuse" your stake, however. :D
As usual, I'll be sending part of the post rewards back into the comment section, feel free to also copy your comment over to youtube!
I am not arguing against anything you have said in this video, but I would like to point out that there is a natural tendency to like those who like you. That is in a literal sense as well as in real life.
While my stake is too small to engage in any of this quid pro quo schemes, I tend to notice if someone came in and said something about my post and liked it. I often check out their posts and may like their posts.
That might be how these circle voters have started out. And with time it devolved into what you have described.
Love your content, always learning something new from it.
Your comment is upvoted by @topcomment
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Yeah and as I said to a certain degree it's fine, it's just that when they then also stop trying it becomes an issue. Let's take me as an example since I do get a fair share of autovotes. If suddenly my videos became shorter, if I just repeated what I said last week, if I stopped replying to comments, voting on others/unique users, etc, etc. At some point this content is going to be overrewarded because all I'm doing is sharing videos from YouTube and nothing else but still getting the same votes I for from when I "still cared". Some aim for that directly because they don't wanna try, they just wanna beat curators who may not post or other users who may not have stake at growing theirs by receiving 8.5% APR on curation + guaranteed votes on every post daily.
Hence author rewards shouldn't be guaranteed and not every post needs to land on the exact same number of votes/value.
I've definitely noticed some authors will write about the same subjects and essentially reword the same points over and over in order to collect on their autovotes - and it can be both frustrating to watch and unencouraging for newer people who make great original posts but don't have autovotes rolling in.
Totally get it. I guess I am still new to this.
Another excellent HIVE video. Vote trading gets to be a bigger deal once people have a significant stake, otherwise it's not much of anything.
I'm glad I subbed, it's nice seeing HIVE content in my YT feed. !BBH
I feel like I read about 40% of the posts that I vote for, but I'm kind of stuck in my following feed, so only way I found new posts was if one of the people I followed, re-blogged someone else.
Luckily now because of redditposh I have been around Hive more and I've found new creators and posts and I consume a lot more, because I want to share posts on Reddit that I personally would like to read too.
do you browse community feeds at all?
No, I go under the "Explore" button in PeakD usually when I'm looking for reddit posts to share and use the "Search" feature (If I don't find posts already from my following feed).
But most of the content I consume myself (like 90%-95%) comes from my "Following feed"
I've maybe ever clicked like 5 times on the "Communities feed" button 😅
try the community feeds! maybe unsubsribe to some if it feels like too much but it's a great place to find new authors and spend some voting power if you have the extra time. Just careful with sus accounts/posts depending on how well moderated/curated the community is. OCD communiry for instance is quite deserted at this point since we decided to empower niche communities instead.
I'm in these communities right now, got any suggestions for well moderated communities for me to add to the list 😅?
I'm open to literally all topics
I hope that your youtube journey will be more successful than mine. Barely anyone was watching my videos and I only had a few subs so it was not worth the time it takes uploading videos. Now I prefer making gaming posts with some screenshots. They remind me what I did while gaming as I write a post.
For me voting at 40 percent seems to be ideal. It allows me to support both my favorite authors and some (mostly smaller) accounts that I don't follow. After I vote comments that I get and posts from the people I follow I still have some voting power left so I use it to upvote some people at splinterlands, holozing or hive gaming communities. I stop voting once my voting power is around 80 percent.
I am sooooo glad you're talking about this, and i commend you cos it's not often that someone that profits or benefits from a system try to break out or speak about certain flaws in the structure and
the voting system was the first thing i noticed here on hive and it just did not seem organic enough, Ultimately, the solution will lie in balancing the interests of long time users or whales( as they are called) with the new users. While disabling this automatic voting system is not be feasible, restricting its influence and promoting fairer voting practices is definitely possible, cos in the long run this old structure might cause more harm than good.
Following you on YouTube now ... but here comes the catch: I check my YouTube account maybe thrice a month ... :)
Circle voting is quite a common and has been around since steem. I know people don't like to hear it, but you see a majority of the same accounts getting big votes. Right or wrong some of these accounts do put out good content. However to see every post get boosted is a bit discouraging to those trying to grow if those votes are distributed more.
Sure and a lot of that is due to autovotes, but those aren't that bad if the authors aren't abusing them in the way i described in the video by lowering their effort in the posts. You can't blame for instance accounts like steempty for autovoting when he himself doesn't post and I don't upvote him (maybe he could update his autovote list more often I suppose), but then you may have users who both post and vote each other constantly which is a bigger issue.
Just like circle jerking, I feel like some vote trading happens naturally and it isn't necessarily a bad thing. It's honestly the evolution and natural growth of a social network. If you're doing it right anyway.
When a society exists on the basis of self-interest, justice and democracy are always challenged.
I think that circle voting is quite a common practice... I mean why would people not do it? Easy and fast money, only reason not to do would be ethics but nothing else... And let's take for example your stake, 10 users of 200-300k HP, upvoting each other and they get exposed, they could just say "make us stop then", togheter they have 3 milion hp power, who can counter that much and equalize 10 posts a day? And that considering just one group of 10 users
another group of 10 bigger users :)
oh yea i checked the richlist, that wouldn't be a big enough group 🤣 need a group of 10 users with 1 milion power each, then you need blocktrades to counter that
you must have pissed off someone to get that 12 auto dust downvotes also
It's really sad how these voting schemes keep circling back. No matter how many times people call it out, there’s always a new angle to exploit. Keeps the game rigged for smaller creators
I think the ideas I mentioned in the video are somewhat complex, but the nice thing about them is that they were spontaneous.
The start is always difficult, especially in the specific category of discussion.
Have a good time
Thank you
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!PIZZA
Greetings, friend, I'll be heading over to your YouTube channel to support you in your project, building a community on Hive, so we all grow.
@acidyo, I paid out 16.936 HIVE and 3.669 HBD to reward 12 comments in this discussion thread.
Yes. All the Whales on Hive are just voting their friends with Hive.vote ….
For 5 years now ….
New Hive bloggers get almost zero and quit.
Hive cannot grow if this continues. Hive.Vote Bot voting must be disabled.
All voting should be manual.
I agree, we have a decentralized selling point but we have a weakness in rewarding articles, which I think most people including me will not read unless they are really interested in the topic, but will vote for based on affinity. Newcomers without good connections will find it difficult to stay on the platform, which affects growth.
I have been saying this for 5 years now but nobody listens…. They just downvote anyone who makes this suggestion.
You've been downvoted for other reasons and you know it.