About the starter "pack" sale

in Holozing Community3 months ago

Hey everyone, while we're waiting on art to be generated and finalized I wanted to discuss a little bit some of the thoughts around the starter sale and what you can expect to get from buying a "pack". The reason I'm quoting 'packs' is because it won't technically be packs, more like a certain type of energy to fit with our opening animation of the assets. Let's first get into what will be in the assets and what some of them will do.


Starter Creatures

First off, of course, the starter creatures of Holozing. They're yet to be named but you can view their 'pose' stance in the naming post. I won't get into much details about the card art just yet cause I'd want that to be a surprise, the same thing with the opening animation in which @rubencress has done an amazing job on along with @mobbs working on the sound effects (how cool when hivers get together to co-operate on things!).

The creatures as has been mentioned before will have 4 stats which have specific min and max amounts for each of the stats based on which creature it is. You can imagine for instance that the Fire Wolf creature focuses on doing a lot of damage but may not have a lot of defense or HP where as the Water Whale may not be quick and crit often since his agility is lower than the others at the same level but is robust and can take a few hits before needing some heals.

The stats are due for adjustment and balance during the alpha and beta phase along with the healers but the creatures will also have a "hidden" stat that'll determine its rarity, basically "how far off max stats is this creature". This is done in order for players not to get their creatures "nerfed" in a way it changes the average rarity of the stats. If a creature for instance has epic level rarity on their Attack, Agility, and Defense but only Blue level rarity on their HP, its average is of Epic rarity so number changes to the balance of the game shall not change the rarity of the stats of the owned creatures of players. Players will however be able to change the stat rarity through training and leveling up as has been mentioned in the past.



Okay, let's now get down to some odds. As you can imagine, getting high-stat creatures is going to be really, really difficult luck-wise. This is done on purpose partly because you'll be able to adjust it as mentioned by training the creatures and partly because these assets such as creatures are meant to be used in more than one game long-term. Thus they're being generated with multi-use in mind and for a lot of players and if everyone managed to generate a close to or max stat creature it wouldn't be as rare. This isn't something we've decided on but you can imagine that a max stat creature at level 1 will have something like 1 in a 50,000 odds to be generated, whereas those at legendary stats will be a bit more common, something like 1 in every 20,000 while we leave room for those at epic stat to have a small chance to hit max level during leveling up.

Okay so what will this mean for the starter "packs"?
The starter packs won't have a cap, we're not fans of limiting how many creatures can exist in a game as we want people to be able to play with each and every creature, even if some of them can only be bought we aim for players to be able to earn their way into a full collection including starter creatures. We've seen some projects like Gods Unchained creating very limited Genesis cards which in turn didn't get used often by competitive players because they literally couldn't afford them as they were so limited in amounts, that's something we definitely want to avoid but not necessarily make it very common neither. We will however allow for a delegation market to exist for cards and assets.

We aim for the starter packs to run for as long as the game is still in beta, upon which players will be able to buy these "alpha packs" (names to be decided) and then we'll be introducing new starter creatures for future packs. Once this happens it also won't mean that the alpha starters will stop being generated but we are going to make them rarer to appear in "beta" packs on top of their stats being skewed towards being even rarer to have max stats than the alpha packs. As an example:

Alpha pack: One of the 4 starter creatures will have a 1 in 50k chance to have max stats, 1 in 20k chance to have legendary stats, 1 in 5k chance to have epic stats. While in the
Beta pack: One of the 4 alpha starter creatures will have a 1 in 100k chance to have max stats, 1 in 40k chance to have legendary stats, 1 in 10k chance to have epic stats while at the same time the drop chance for alpha starters compared to beta starters will be 5-10%.

(Exact odds and drop chances not yet fully decided)

While this means that Alpha starters will get artificially rarer it leaves the decicion of how many exist in the hands of the community and how many Alpha starter packs they buy and how many they open.


Zing Distribution to Collection

With the start of the Alpha starter pack sales we will also be opening up Zing inflation to collectors, this means that those buying packs and opening them will be able to also collect hourly Zing rewards on holozing.com based on their collection. Here we also haven't decided yet how much of those Zing rewards will go to creatures compared to unopened packs (or if unopened packs should receive any) and the point system to count what kind of creatures you have (stat rarity will determine how much points you get for the daily reward distribution). This means that those buying packs will be eligible for Zing inflation ahead of the game's release where captured creatures will also count towards it.

Similar to Hive Power delegations giving curation rewards, we will give delegatees the rewards if your cards are delegated out as this will increase the demand to delegate cards other than playing and competing with them and not make it a "double dip" for collectors earning both delegation rewards and collection rewards.

Okay, that was a lot about the creatures, let's briefly talk about other assets you'll be able to find in the packs.


Other items

Capturing device, every healer will need its own capturing device (a form of gun combined with a Polaroid camera), this capture device will need laser ammo in an effort to capture a creature. The ammo gets used upon each attempt and an ammo shell will have limited uses based on rarity. Both the device and ammo will increase your chance of capturing a creature based on other factors such as the creature's current health percentage, status change, and its rarity stat. Both capturing device and ammo will have their own rarity with unique stats and effects, more on that later.

Healing gloves, every healer will need a pair of healing gloves to perform healing abilities on their creature. These will have unique stats and rarity as well along with level requirements for the healer who has them equipped. Stats such as amount of mana increase of the healer, mana generation and healing power increase. Amount of mana boosts your healers total mana, mana generation increases how much mana a healer can recover over time when off-battle and healing power will boost your healing abilities output.

Cards, cards will be the holders of your creatures. In battles, you'll be able to pick what creature you want to send out from your cards and they'll also tell you the exact stats of the creatures you capture. You will have to decide which card you're using (if you have unique ones) on your capturing device to have the creature be held within if a successful capture occurs.

Consumables, water/drinks and food will be important in the daily life of a healer and its creatures. These will help to generate mana faster and generate ability points for your healer and their creatures because without ability points you won't be able to use some of your favorite abilities.

Aside from the starter creatures, all of the assets mentioned after will be something players will be able to generate with professions. The starter packs will just increase the chance of how good of a rarity the creatures and items will have compared to the skill/level required for professions (i.e. a healer will need high profession skill to compete with the RNG of starter packs, thus they'll be in more demand for crafting).


Ending thoughts.

I think this way of introducing starters that can't be captured in the game will be a good way for the team to raise further funds for development. Collectors being able to leave packs unopened may give the packs some added value later on if the game is successful and player base increases where they'll want to open alpha/beta packs that aren't obtainable from the game/team anymore. Not completely cutting off alpha starters in future sets will also help with allowing new players to buy them in future sets while the odds are lower to still get a chance to use them instead of having to rent through delegations or buying them at premium prices. The Zing rewards to collectors will help offset some of that missing supply shock of the alpha starters and potential delegation rentals missed cause players were able to get the alpha starters in future sets. This method also ensures that the team continuously sells packs in all sets and development doesn't have to rely solely on HP delegations/other future potential income sources. Something to keep in mind is also that there aren't many games in the space where all income sources are only used to further develop the game and grow the ecosystem on top of not just printing new tokens to dilute players and investors, so this will be quite an exciting journey!

Thanks for reading and as always, feel free to drop your thoughts and opinions in the comment section regarding the contents of this post!

Images were generated with Midjourney for this post alone and don't reflect on the game.


The more I read updates and ideas about Holozing, the more my interest increases :)
I also really like that cards with very high stats are very difficult to find and at the same time there is no limit to cards from the various editions because it could be an incentive for players who join later.
My daughter is only 10 years old and she loves the Pokemon world and reading this post I thought Holozing could be her first web 3.0 game...that would be great
!discovery 40
@tipu curate

Do we know yet how much these starter packs will cost and will we be able to use Zing to buy them aswell ?

I also feel like the zing tokens and the creatures' numbers will be heavily inflated, would love to hear soon about some of the thoughts about burns and sinks for those assets

Anyways keep up the great work! Super excited for this project.

No cost decision yet but it'll be a bit on the upper side compared to other packs on hive as there's a lot to be had and we wouldn't want average players to feel the need to buy many. Getting a healer and starter pack might be something around what you pay for a new web2 game since this will get you access to the gameplay and being able to earn zing from the get-go if you open a pack (not to mention other ways players will be able to earn later).

Yuhh you opened so many new details about game gadgets, creatures. That now it seems more and more attractive with each new post about it! 👍
This part of daily life makes me wondering how it'll be realized because it seems can become an alternative reality world when you evolved not only in collecting and battles but also to the such usual life moments like drinks, food etc. (Don't know why while reading this part I thought about tamagotchi game /toy from my childhood)
This alpha and beta took me back to the beginning of splinterlands. But I understand it will be different kind of game and it's not right way to compare it with HoloZing. Also I wonder rather it's already defined or not price of starter set?

Hehe we've definitely been planning the game for a long time now and only a few months ago started getting things rolling. ^^

I replied about that just before this comment if you don't mind looking there instead!

Surely I read it.
So now I can just cross fingers and wait for next updates/details 😉

we will give delegatees the rewards if your cards are delegated out

Delegate to whom? other players?
Why would holozing reward me if I delegate my cards out to someone else?

how much of those Zing rewards will go to creatures compared to unopened packs

Imo, hoarding should not be rewarded. Opened "packs" should be the criteria to receive rewards, depending on stats. Rewarding Unopened packs is kinda like promoting inactivity.
Opened packs makes it easier to divide and distribute the allocated inflation (by the rarity score)
Players and investors can and have to make a decision to either play, delegate, or sell. On the contrary of simply holding on to the packs and collecting dust.
Opened packs branches out to more opportunities to create interaction and engagement in-game and out which is always beneficial.

On the flipside I agree that buying packs (at least for alpha stage), opened or unopened, should be rewarded. Only because it is a sort of commitment that helps holozing grow. So number of packs purchased can be a criteria to reward - maybe in a different way instead of from the zing inflation.

Is the team planning to add a social tab to the game, which will be like a forum to encourage ideas and discussion? Or will it be limited to existing channels like discord and the c/Holozing?

Why would holozing reward me if I delegate my cards out to someone else?

I meant the other way, collection rewards would go to the player who is actively delegating a creature from someone else.

I don't disagree about unopened packs, it may be a temporary thing and only getting a fraction of opened packs as rewards.

We do intend to have chats ingame for the official "release" which will also have open world map.

I am waiting with bated breath for the game to start. It looks like we will need to learn a lot about the game, mostly by trial and error, to be competitive.

What will be the criteria to be included in the closed alpha?

We'll try to invite those experienced with game testing and balancing and hope that the closed version won't stick for long until we can open it to many others. Even if we're quite far with the game logic we'd still want it to be presentable and look nice before we open it up to everyone which is something that takes time with 3d generation of 2d assets and 3d animation.

I do like the extra perks of Alpha over beta and makes sense since people are taking a risk/chance on a game. Even though honestly I feel like it's going to be a good success and not as risking of an investment. However really I just want to play the thing and not really in it for the money I'm loving how the overall game sounds so far without any screenshots etc. If it's profitable later then so be it. Reminds me of my heavy Alpha investment days lol

Yeah the game's been one of our main things we've focused on, I'm going to post about the current spendings we've had so far for transparency so you can check it yourself. We do however want the game to look nice come open beta release to attract outsiders so the starter pack sales will hopefully help fund that!

loving it. any date in mind? O.O

Not yet, still fine-tuning the card art and adding it to the opening animation along with some backend stuff!

awww at least end of this year is it possible? :P xmas wouldnt be bad


The more I am reading the updates, the more I am liking how a lot of thought is being invested into the game. I am a bit concerned about balancing issues. I expect the rarest one to be strong, but it shouldn't be OP. There could also be power creep. Additionally, will you be adjusting the stats of older monsters eventually to keep them up to date? That might introduce problems.

Yeah, have had a lot of exp with balancing issues in web2 games, I think we wanna try the "collect them all, save them for each patch" kind of thing, some times some are a bit stronger than others, some times others are, some times some are never strong, some times some are often strong. Balancing is hard and all games face that issue, but that's also why we're introducing kind of ridiculous astronomical odds of reaching high stats on top of creatures also having rarity in their abilities along with there being range in damage and heal output and strategies that might give you an edge even when facing stronger opponents. Some times you might find a gem that beats the current meta out of pure luck, if you then decide to use it for PvP and collection rewards/titles/achievements or sell them to the highest bidder, it'll be your choice.

Either way we're looking forward to tackling balancing stuff together with the community, who knows, we may become one of the most balanced games out there. ^^

I also read the comments and I agree with many people. This game seems to be much more detailed and fun than other web3 games. I don't want to denigrate other games, on the contrary, I'm just expressing my thoughts on how good this game will be.

When the packs come out it will be hard to decide whether it is more profitable to open them or keep them. I'm a pack opening addict, I think I'll open half of them and keep the other half :)

I am very excited about everything in the game and I feel like I will need a lot of ZING tokens.

cool, I can't wait to see how and when this pack will be available.



Cannot wait to buy a starter pack.

Awesome, excited for the pack sales. Hope to unlock some legendary cards. Some sneak peeks of some cards before launch would be amazing. Can't wait to see how it looks.

Wow, it's good to read about the latest update and I truly appreciate the effort you are putting in place for everything to go smoothly. Well done.

The rarity system for the starter creatures sounds really interesting. Having creatures with different hidden rarity stats that determine how close they are to max stats adds a lot of depth and replayability when trying to capture the strongest creatures.

wow.... excited for the game, the seems that animations and sounds going to make crazy even the it is amzing to know more about the starting creatures, i don't know why? but my favourite creature is grass Raccon.... 😃

Thankyou @acidyo for this amazing game

Haha I like him a lot too, he looks like he's plotting something! xD

exactly... 😜

It's incredible the amount of users that have joined the community for the game, I can't imagine how many more will join when it's ready and released, in Latin America surely already has some fans anxiously waiting to buy one of these packs

i can't wait, hoping it cay but either with zingtoken or hive
i think it is time to gathering some hive to preparing buying packs
Great news by the way

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Well, it seems we're almost ready with the whole basis of the game. When can we expect it to start, I can't wait since Pokemon was one of my favorite childhood game.

Thanks for the update! Looking forward to participate in the sale! :)

Awesome. Can’t wait to buy some. I’ll start sharing these updates on Nostr / Plebstr … lots of web3 gamers over there.

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I need one starter pack now 😂😂😂

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Hi @acidyo I am happy to be a part of this community and hope to make many friends here. Now I start my new life after prison. I will be grateful for your support.

The gradual release of game-related information builds up my excitement as we approach the official launch of the game! 😁

The starter packs won't have a cap, we're not fans of limiting how many creatures can exist in a game as we want people to be able to play with each and every creature, even if some of them can only be bought we aim for players to be able to earn their way into a full collection including starter creatures.

I appreciate this initiative because the idea of working hard to earn a full collection is appealing, and it ensures that ultra-rare monsters are not out of reach for players like me due to limitations! ✌️

The "Other Items" added more to my excitement, I am now able to imagine some aspects of the game like capturing a creature.

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I think it will be an amazingly interesting journey that I am looking forward to

how hard it is to wait for the release of this game


Thankd for the detailed update. Does this means that packs will potentially be available before the launch of the game?
Is there a limit to the number of packs that one can buy? Just wondering whether people can hold packs and continuously be rewarded when they are not using them.

Greetings friend @acidyo, I am more and more excited and anxious to see the game running, I am very grateful for the information you share with us, the idea of keeping the "packs" starters of the alpha and beta versions, I like too much because they motivate people who are from the beginning to buy packs and gives new players the opportunity to buy such "packs" to continue increasing their collection.

I am very interested and attentive to be part of the alpha and beta version, I will be very attentive to the information that you share with us from your account or from the official Holozing account.

According to what you say, what would be more advisable to do with the starter "packs", keep them in collection without opening them or open them and see what they contain and what probabiities of high stats you can get?