This post is a reply to Why is that berniesanders asshole flagging Korean posts?
1. Korean Community is Growing Bigger and Fast
There are great and positive perceptions in Korean communities, both crypto and non-crypto ones. Our growth is explosive and positiveness is going around our community. According to @arcange's post, active users of Korean community has more than quadrupled and posts and comments have increased a lot as well.
This is not only about number of users, but also investments. Korean community was and is the biggest buyer of Steem, especially when Steem price was decreasing. While many whales were reducing their stakes, Korea community recruited more investors hence supported Steem price. Also many of them have powered up. We now have 21 members in top 300 (at lesat $25,000 worth) and in total over 7,000 MVESTS, which equates over 3 million dollars. This is about 8% of total active stakes.
2. Views Are Really High
Accroding to OECD Data, population of Korea is only 4.4% of the total or about 1/20. Roughly speacking, a unit views for a Korean language post may be regarded to have at least 5-10 times greater views than English posts with the consideratino of the scale effect.
Here are interesting examples. @maa's two posts hit Google Now suggestion and got over 1,000 views. Isn't it cool? More Korean people are paying attention to and will come KR community.
https://steemit.com/kr/@maa/2017-5-14
3. We Need to Consider Contexts
Fourteen days ago, we felt very bad and upset due to the downvote. Why? We had a newbie highschool girl and gave her our best welcome. We think that she can be the gateway person who opens the door toward Korean teenagers and can trigger mass dispersion of Steemit in Korea. But her first post was downvoted. She seems so disappointed and the traction has greatly decreased. Although the flags were removed, the effect remained since he did flag during downvote-only period. I asked him to leave some message to make her feeling better, but nothing happened. I am really concerning this kind of thing happens again.
https://steemit.com/kr/@lhy/introducemyself
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We now have a wonderful illustrator, well-known Korean crypto analyst and investors, and many other important members. Their posts sometimes seem get too much, but I think it maybe not if we count what they will bring in the future.
Our Thoughts
I do not want to restrict his freedom to downvote, but want to request do it in more prudent and consistent manner.
Appendix: Responding to image he posted (@engagement is his sub-account)
Something that was failed to be mentioned here, which is the most important part actually, is that Bernie/Engagement is downvoting in the last 12 hours where no upvotes can counter his downvotes and he is voting with much more rshares than anyone else on the platform. He can't downvote before the 12 hour mark because he will be countered with an upvote if his downvote is "too large". So, instead he is abusing the system and downvoting with a larger voting weight than anyone else on the platform is currently being able to use and only in the last 12 hours where upvotes are not allowed. It's abuse in every sense of the word.
He is able to reduce a very popular post's payout by 70% with a single downvote because of the way things are currently set up on the platform.
If he wants to downvote he can do it in the normal allotted time with the normal allotted voting weight like everyone else on the platform. Bernie/Engagement is playing by a different set of rules than every other poster on here. How's that for fair?
Flag on this fair (at least no hate speech or abusing) comment, and I think this is how he plays. He may try to hide fair criticism by his powerful downvotes.
I find the waging war on an entire country's posts something deeply disturbing. I noticed that he flagged my post that was created specifically for Venezuelans, letting them know they can earn $5 per day on Steemit, the one that has brought in this young Venezuelan to Steemit. Why it was downvoted, when it's actively brining in new users? And writing it with the idea that people who have never heard of Steemit before will join Steemit as a result. When I found the young man from Venezuela who had somehow found my post on Reddit and joined STeemit as a direct result of my post, his downvoting of it makes him look even worse. He's actively destroying this platform, as his actions are in direct opposition of growth. I think I have about had enough of his behavior.
It is all quite disturbing, for sure. We as a community really have to band together because if we let one person abuse an entire platform, that doesn't sit well with me.
You're a fucking moron, but, that's nothing new. Try looking at the facts for once ya twat. Go back do DASH or whatever shitcoin you're attempting to earn from this week. You won't be earning much more here.
A translator should be avaible on the website if we are going to explode with different languages
Good idea.
Holy cow 2.04$ for your upvote thanks alot clayop
I always thought there should be a reputation requirement in order to have the ability to flag a post. For instance, maybe a reputation of 60 to flag. This would keep people who are new and maybe just disgruntled because the money is not coming in fast enough from ruining someone's posts. I feel like I can say this because I'm only in the 40's myself and am still learning how things work.
Yeah I suggested something related. It should be our future priority.
Your concern is valid, I don't know by how much the rewards were cut by flagging. I'd like to see more information about that but I'd like to think that the people that use flag, have Steemit's best interest in mind and not just their own wallet or close circle of friends.
And sometimes, maybe, those people have yet to think things that far that some have. My view on the issue is complicated, at the same time I'd like to see new people getting rewarded well, who represent whole new communities of people, that yet are not using Steemit, but at the same time it would be negative to see their rewards decline sharply after few posts.
It's hard to come to consensus on what fair rewards is when the consensus is formed by thousands of people around the world who don't share the same information base, which is used to make these decisions.
It usually cuts over $100 and in my case about $300. About 40% of his flags are on kr posts. I think daily cut is several hundres, so he probably decrease at least $3000 so far.
But English contents are not very accessible for kr members so voting on them may yield worse results. I expect there will be more posts (as like now) and the rewards will be dispersed more.
Interesting. Sounds like kr community is really booming.
I hope we don't lose too many people thanks to this flagging. Hopefully these individuals on receiving end understand that it's not personal and that their rewards will keep growing as our whole community grows. If Steem becomes mainstream they'll feel far worse for giving up in these early days!
Thanks for explaining this situation.
I'll once again mention what I perceive could be a great improvement, namely, to separate the "flag" idea from the "down vote" idea.
Each post would show only the current sum of votes, and a "flag" would be reserved only for bad behavior.
😄😇😄
적어도 한국과 인도네시아 커뮤니티를 핍박하지마십시오. 한국과 인도네시아 커뮤니티는 향후 스팀발전을 견인할 가장 강력한 커뮤니티입니다.
At least do not persecute the Korean and Indonesian communities. The Korean and Indonesian communities are the most powerful community to drive future steem generation.
Dear Lee
I think that Berniesanders is an asshole that does not have any standards about flagging and just does not want to allow a lot of rewards of Korean community. Berniesanders is just a young child who wants to be identified his influence by little fishes. There is not even 1% of adults thinking of expanding the community or marketing. So do not speak elegant words like expanding markets. It's just a little child's fuss. Never mind.
You're a fucking moron. How's that?
Thank you berniesanders
Nice flag and censorship on this criticism. (FYI asshole is a self description of him on his profile "dedicated asshole"). This seems "how"
Aw, don't be so butthurt just because your community posts nothing but shit that you reward ridiculously.
thank you @renohq.
the economic power of korea is ranked 10th in the world.
the same is true of sports like the olympics.
we have strong weapons like you in our community, Isn't it?
i'm sure our potential is endless.
And cryptocurrencies are viral in Korea! Steem has a really strong weapon :)
Keep up the good work, if you have time, read my comments here too in support of the community and the kr community specifically.
The answer is still Yes.
just say "still yes"? any more comments?
Nope, the posts are over-rewarded and that's all there is to is. I've said more than enough.
Why not. I respect that each person's thoughts.
the point is. if you dont like the downvotes, find more people to upvote. i thinkk dan said that in the past. if you dont like one whale, find other wahles to put that whales votes in check.
You don't get it, he is downvoting in the last 12 hours where no upvotes can counter. And he is downvoting with more voting weight than anyone else on the platform is allowed to be voting with due to the whale experiment. It's not a normal downvote that's being discussed here.
I didnt know that. well it is his SP. so he can do whatever he likes with it. everybody should just keep posting and ignoring that matter. justt write 1 blogpost more for the lost rewardss
Hahahaha fucking love this guy he did give me 5$ on my 420 meme post do your thang @berniesanders
You are being an evil bully.
Here is my response: Early adopters should be rewarded, not punished
Thanks!
I do not think "kr" posts are over-valued.
SteemIt is a free-market. The "kr" community on SteemIt is growing rapidly. Content for the "kr" community would naturally garner more upvotes from the "kr" community. There is nothing wrong with that.
A growing SteemIt community helps all SteemIt users around the world. The rising price of STEEM is the evidence.
I support the "kr" community on SteemIt. I cannot read Korean but a picture is worth a thousand words and usually worth an upvote.
There are far more languages I cannot read than I can read. A smile, a photo, and a few emoji's usually bridge the language barrier even when the Google translator does not :-)
Steem on,
Mike
Thanks! You may love his posts
https://steemit.com/@tonesquare
love his work! I've been participating in the Korean community lately. I feel like that's not cool in what's happening here, is there a valid reason for #kr flagging?
Hopefully his works won't be flagged just because they are over $150
who is the highschool girl who got upset? just curious.
lhy is the girl and kr comminity is upset.
rightly so.
Thanks a bunch for posting such positive problem-solving information. Such an interesting exposure of data that underlines a clear and coherent point of view. All for one and one for all! Namaste :)
Congratulations @clayop!
Your post was mentioned in my hit parade in the following category:
Korean and German Communities are the best
Fully agree. You can read about the German community performance here
my man!
It's interesting to see a lot of Koreans here but Steem is growing so fast in whole world. I hope one day Turkish community will be as big as Korean. :)
We all do, man. We want the WHOLE world to join in!
Let every man, woman and child unite, here on Steemit. Let the current community grow to become whales so we can spread the wealth to those who're most in need!!!
Yes, and I am delegating 200 MV for Turkish community.
@clayop wrote you a good quality article.
My answer was not overrated. And the biggest problem is that I think malevolent down-boat is a problem.
If you read this article, I hope you enjoy Steam itself.
@clayop 님 좋은 글 감사합니다~~
wow... amazing...
Wow, that's awesome! So interesting. Thanks for sharing!
great post
i love the Korean people and this article just shows they like to stay informed
Read this @mariacherries
On the other hand some people might be voting korean posts just because of their economic value, not even understanding a word ☺
Some may do, some may use google translation. But yeah those profit-oriented votings matter.
Right, but that problem is not Korea specific: many users vote for 'famous' writers because they hope and expect many other votes to follow later, so that they get much curation reward. If that is a problem (that not quality is rewarded, but being famous) then it is not a Korean problem, but a general problem (which one could try to solve by making the reward curve more linear maybe).
Fully agree. That is in line with why I argued to change the system against for-profit bots/users.
(gasp) you mean....
Maybe this idea of merging upvotes and downvotes into one entity would solve issues like that.
This post just gives me so much faith for this website, system, people and just people in general. There's such a great attitude on here for encouraging people worldwide.
Thanks for the info!
dunno...don't care.
I either unfollow or mute anything I can't understand.
anything not written in english qualifies.
어쩌면 당신은 시간에 번역기를 사용 해봐야하는데, 나는 그것에 좋은 대화를 느낀다.
TRANSLATION
maybe you should try using a translator at times, i do if i sense some nice conversation in it.
Korean investments skyrocketed in general in the crypto sphere. At this point the only sane thing to do is support the growth (no need to over-reward some posts).
Over-rewarded is subjective and contextual. And there are high and low payout posts always. If a post is downvoted simply due to it has over $200 reward regardless of its quality and author's potential, it is not fair.
There is a lot of downvoting from whales though due to this experiment we are going through. I got downvoted as well. I don't mind if its for a while.
He is voting with a different voting weight than every other person on here. He is voting in the last 12 hours so that he can use his max voting power with no upvotes to counter him. It is not normal downvoting behavior. He is abusing the current 12 hour system.
It's a different issue, and even contradicting.
I personally feel that down votes should be used very springily. Only if the content is offensive or deceiving or just a copy-paste from the internet, then it should be down voted. Down votes can have a very bad demotivating effect on the poster. And down voting a member belonging to a specific community is even more bad. If some posts are overvalued then better not up vote them, instead of feeling jealous and down vote them.
So are the Koreans playing the system or what?
Thank you to our Korean brothers and sisters who use Steemit and those who have invested in Steem! You are valued here!
Rest assured this @berniesanders guy will not be able to continue as he has for much longer.
Lol why is that?
really great work
so deep
Great post. Follow me at https://steemit.com/@adrianmada321
Amazing, I like it so much..
나는 한국을 좋아한다. 그들은 견과이다.
@barrydutton
한국인들의 행동이나 결과물에 대하여
외국인
특히 서양인들이 이해하기 힘든 경우가 있을 수 있다.
그러나 이해하기 힘들다고 해서
잘못이라고 생각하거나
잘못을 찾아내려는 노력을 한다면
그런 노력자체가 어리석음의 결과물이다.
백인들이 아메리카 대륙과 아프리카를 처음 발견했을때
그곳의 원주민에게 저질렀던 행위를 떠올려보길 바란다.
한국인이 대단한 집중력과 열정을 가진
민족임을 잊지 않기 바란다.
한국인을 제대로 이해한다면
당신의 사고의 폭도 넓어질 수 있을 것이다.
^^
I have purposely commented on Korean community posts, to encourage that community.
I do not hear back from anyone there usually except @slowwalker but I've been planning on doing a post for weeks, to tell people the kr community is very strong and they can teach the rest of us how to support and look after one another.
I have commented many times, on posts how well the community is doing and hope we can all succeed TOGETHER.
Your Steemit friend Barry
@barrydutton 님 당신은 한글을 많이 아십니까? 저는 영어를 잘 못합니다 그리고 영어를 하더라도 사전을 찾아보면서 그에 맞는 단어를 찾습니다 저는 당신의 다운보트를 부정적으로 생각하지 않습니다 정말 가치없는글에 무작위적인 추천은 글작성에 많은 시간을 투자하는 사람들에게 실망을 줄수 있습니다 하지만 이러한 활동은 매우 조심히 해야합니다 자칫 잘못하면 많은 시간과 공을 들여 작성한 게시글이 무시당할수 있습니다 제가 한글로 작성하는 이유는 당신과 당신의 친구가 한국어를 잘한다고 알고 있습니다 내용의 변질이 우려되어 한글로 작성합니다 참고로 저는 @economyit 이라는 공익의 아이디도 사용하고 있습니다 몇주전부터 @gotoperson과 @economyit에 다운보트가 발생하여 저를 다운보트한 사람들의 댓글에 글을 남겼습니다 당신이 말하는 답변이 없듯 나에대한 댓글에도 답변이 없었습니다 누구나가 같은 입장과 같은 생각일수가 없습니다 하지만 분명한것은 우리들 모두가 스팀잇의 가치상승을 생각하는 것입니다 당신도 우리 한국커뮤니티가 발전하는것을 싫어하지는 않을것입니다 우리도 많은 생각을 하고 있습니다 과연 무엇이 진정 스팀잇을 발전시키고 앞으로 더 크게 성장할수 있는 방향인지를요 참고로 저는 제가 직접 작성하고 느끼고 분석하고 만든내용물만 포스팅합니다 당신이 생각하는 그런 저질적인 글이 아니며 당신이 다운보트한 글도 그 어떠한 글이 저질적인 글은 한개도 없습니다 지금까지 제가 활동한것은 @economyit을 통해서 알수 있을것입니다 부탁드립니다 한국 커뮤니티의 발전을 다운보트로 저해하지 말아주세요.
안녕!! 환영!
나는 서울 성도에서 살았다! 나는 한국에서의 시간을 사랑했습니다! 모든 한국인이 Steemit에서 잘 지내기를 바랍니다!
Thanks for your kind words. I looked at your comment history but unfortunately your last comment seems little like ad. This
We welcome all other communities, and are actually supporting some other communities and will do more. Together!
That is because I was out all day away from the keyboard, and if you look at the post I did today to try to help out a new Steemian member, you can see what I have been up to, hopefully you will look at my page and see that.
I am on limited time here, and wanted to comment back to everyone quickly, I have health issues and needed to reply to many people, quickly so that is why I pasted my replies so at least people saw I got back to them.
I do not normally do that, but had to in this case, so I can get offline tonite being later for me here.
You will see my work better here, how hard I work...
https://steemit.com/@barrydutton
I support all communities, including the Korean community. Having lived in Asia myself, I have cultivated an enormous respect for Asian culture as it taught me how to be less selfish......I lived in Japan several times.... I know Japan is different from Korea, but I feel that some of the philosophies are similar. Anyway, this growth is good. Working together, problems can be overcome.