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RE: Mystery "vaping lung illness" SOLVED!

in #cannabis3 years ago

I wondered when you were going to weigh in on the recent vaping hysteria.

One bone of contention though... I think we can still blame "legality or illegality" a bit, or "regalization" as you call it. Note that the cartridges that NBC & CannaSafe found with myclobutanil (and Vitamin E acetate) were all illegal black market products. Here in the US, people are turning to black market cannabis vape carts because of the steep price of the "legal" stuff sold by dispensaries. The taxes are onerous. Really bad. I don't know if the same is going on in Canada.

There's a case to be made that the deaths are the result of legalization and heavy taxes (as opposed to decriminalization).


Myclobutanil and cannabis have both existed a long time, but this problem never came up until legalization in Canada a few years ago, and the USA more recently. People never used it on cannabis until big companies began trying to drive the price per gram down. Trying to say it has something to do with the illegal/unlicensed/free/black/unregulated market is really misguided. Time and time again, it's legal companies doing this to people. We used to "know your grower" but that was made impossible by "legalization", and now there's poison in the legal supply and people are dying.

Well, maybe it's a combo of factors -- legalization and the rise of vape pens. Vape pens are incredibly popular now. And there definitely is a problem with black market/unregulated vape cartridges.

Definitely? I disagree. It's the unregulated cartridges that are safe, and the legalized ones that are killing people.

Where are you getting your information? In the US, the CDC and the mass media is reporting that it's primarily the black market ones causing the problems. Additionally, about 11% of the cases do not even involve cannabis products.

To wit:

The latest national and state findings suggest products containing THC, particularly those obtained off the street or from other informal sources (e.g. friends, family members, illicit dealers), are linked to most of the cases and play a major role in the outbreak.

If you have a contrary information or evidence, I'd be interested.

I'm saying that the CDC are corrupt. I guess that's the missing piece that has you confused. Once you realize they're lying, anything they said is suspect. You want my evidence? I want theirs. They don't have any and have been caught lying nonstop. Nothing they say matches up with anything else they say, but you want to give them the benefit of the doubt? Come on, you're smarter than that!

I don't doubt it. But I say NBC News (your main source) is also (demonstrably) corrupt and lies like a rug, so anything they say is also suspect. You cannot trust the CDC or the mainstream news. I take anything government agencies or the MSM tells me with a grain of salt, regardless of my own confirmation bias. I would personally love it if NBC had somehow "solved" the mystery here, but their paltry, unscientific testing doesn't mean a whole lot, unfortunately (I'm not even sure CannaSafe is trustworthy). As someone directly concerned with the safety of vaping products, the best I can do is triangulate the truth from a number of directions and use the precautionary principle as best I can.

It's not smart to jump to conclusions simply because they align with my own fears or wishes.

Jumping to a conclusion is good when it's the correct one, and doing so will save people's lives, which (supposedly) is the goal. Further confirmation will come once this theory is put to the test, but so far, the CDC refuses to do so. And they've designated themselves the gatekeepers of the solution to this "crisis".

You're suggesting NBC is lying that a lab they hired detected Myclobutanil in all the tainted samples they sent in? The mainstream media lies, all the time, but how could THAT be a lie? WHY would that be a lie, when the lie would easily be detected and exposed? Sometimes the media tells the truth, like when they have a legit story, and want "the scoop". It drives their ratings and makes them money in a legitimate way. Sure, they lie, but they also tell the truth. Just because the media says Myclobutanil is in all the tainted samples doesn't make that a lie. The veracity of the claim will have to be tested another way.

Myclobutanil's effects when heated and inhaled are exactly the effects seen in this "mystery substance" the CDC can't seem to identify. It dissolves the lungs, leaving people gasping for air, low O2 saturation in the blood, pale, low energy, convolutions, coma, and death. Exactly what the mystery substance is doing to people in the USA right now. Coincidence? Further testing would tell us, but hasn't been done.

Are you aware (if you read the post, you are) that Canada already had an identical "vaping crisis", back in 2015? People were sick and dying. The mystery substance turned out to be Myclobutanil.

There's no way Myclobutanil can show up in 10 of 10 tainted samples and NOT be the culprit. Your devil's advocate position is cute but completely baseless, and only done to be contradictory, and throw doubt on an issue which is costing people their lives. Stop.

The other thing I forgot to mention: your source (NBC) claims laboratory tests found pesticides or residual solvents in all of the cartridges except for the few purchased at legal dispensaries. So how did you come to the conclusion??

It's the unregulated cartridges that are safe, and the legalized ones that are killing people.

This is what I'm trying to understand.