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This is The Wild Bunch in their prime. Sundance is on the front row left side and Butch is front row right side.
Howdy folks and greetings from the Great Plains of North Texas where we had snow last night! This is the first time in years that I've seen snow here, look at this:
See that spec of white there? That's snow ya'll! Here's a closer look:
Told ya! But of course it's gonna be 70 degrees on Sunday so..back to typical Texas winter weather.
I'm starting a new series today about a couple of guys who became very famous outlaws out West, Butch and Sundance. I asked for opinions on doing this subject because I didn't know if people wanted to read about a story of which they already knew the ending but the responses were all positive so here we go!
Butch's background
The beginning is a good place to start so I'm gonna go back before Butch's birth so you can understand his background. Sundance is a little more difficult because he was a drifter and no one knows where he came from or from who.
Butch was a Mormon so it's easy to find his background because the Mormons like to keep detailed records of everyone. His Grandparents were from Lancashire, England and joined the Mormon church after hearing missionaries talk about this new kind of faith. That was in the 1850's.
Brigham Young decided to move the church West because they were getting too much flak from more conservative Believers on the East coast. People didn't like his stance on things like polygamy and some other things. I think he had like 27 wives or some such thing.
So he decided to get the hell out of Dodge, so to speak, and head West into the wilderness and carve out their own territory in Utah. He also called for people of the faith all over the world to come to America and join him.
Butch's Grandparents migrate to America
That's when Butch's Grandparents decided to make the journey to America and head West. They weren't alone. Actually thousands came, mostly from Europe. Butch's Grandfather's name was Robert and he was a factory worker so they were poor. They sold their cottage, cow and furniture, everything they had really, to pay for the voyage to America. Took 5 weeks to get here by steam ship.
Once in New York they took a train to Iowa City, Iowa because that's as far as West as the trains went. They still had 1,300 miles to go to get to Utah and Salt Lake City. I love this part of the story...Brigham Young thought it would take too long to train inexperienced Europeans how to handle horses and oxen to pull the wagons so he provided what they call Hand Carts.
So the people THEMSELVES had to push and pull these carts over rough trails, hills, valleys, mountains..in sweltering heat and bitter cold.
Here's an artist's rendition:
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You talk about brutal. Wow. And look, they still make those carts that you can rent:
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Because for some reason people like to do re-enactments:
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I have no idea why.. but power to them if they're willing to work that hard for the experience. I might do a mile. I like the rules that come with the rental carts like "stay away from the wheels" and "no riding on the carts" lol. You KNOW people would be riding on the carts, at least down the hills!
The best one was "No duct tape" ha! What? I wouldn't be able to go after all. lol.
It took Butch's Grandparents 3.5 months to make the trip! Can you imagine pushing and pulling that 600 pound cart through the snow and mud and up the mountains for 3.5 months? That just blows my mind. Much of that distance was through hostile Indian territory too but I don't think they were ever bothered by the tribes.
The Indians were probably totally baffled and felt sorry for them! It had to be one of the largest, most arduous treks ever done. But they made it and settled in.
Kids kids and more kids
His Grandparents had a passle of kids and one would be Butch's dad, his dad's name was Maxi. When Maxi got married he and his wife had 13 kids! Butch was the oldest. Well his real name was Bob. He and his dad were super close but his dad had to be away alot working different jobs to pay for all those costs of raising 13 kids.
His dad began to drift away from the Church functions and strict adherence to doctrines like smoking. Bob also began smoking at an early age and also drifted away from church functions and doctrines.
Butch grows resentful
Maxi was rather defiant of authority, even the church's authority, plus a little rebellious and Bob was exactly the same way. A number of incidents would continue to shape Bob's views and I'll get into those in the next post because I like to examine what causes people to become outlaws.
I hope ya'll can have a little patience in this story because it doesn't start out with a bang. But don't worry, that's coming.
Thanks for reading folks, God bless you all!
-jonboy Texas
the gentleman redneck
PS- What is two miles long and has two teeth?
An unemployment line in West Virginia!
I had no idea about those pull-carts. Never heard of them before! That's really something, to haul those things 1,300 miles? Again after reading one of your blogs I just have to stop and shake my head in disbelief... how crazy tough were these people? Amazing!
haha! I know sir Keith, are we total wimps today? At least compared to those people we are! When you stop to think of no restroom facilities, no baths or running water, no beds to sleep in. And almost all of them weren't use to this, they weren't frontiersmen they were mostly city dwellers which makes it even more amazing. I'm glad you liked the post, I know I got sidetracked by the journey of the Mormons and the hand carts but I couldn't help myself because it was so interesting! lol.
Yeah, people do toughen up on the road... I friend of mine arrived on the west coast from Ontario by riding his bicycle. That's 4,500 km or roughly 2,800 miles. He said he was a wimp when he got started. By the time he got over the last high mountain pass, he says he wasn't a wimp anymore! (Just plain nuts in my view!)
ha! oh man, do you know how long that took him? That's an amazing ride.
Ha! oh man, do you
Know how long that took him? That's
An amazing ride.
- janton
I'm a bot. I detect haiku.
Think it might have been three months. Hey look, haikubot says you're a poet!
Looking forward to more on the story.
Love you used the expression, ‘Get the hell out of Dodge.’
I think I would try to saddle up & ride a donkey rather than pull those carts in the conditions endured. U&R
haha! I think that may have been against the rules redheadpei! They were mighty big on rules and everyone seemed to follow them. lol. Thanks so much for reading and commenting!
Oh hell no. My family would be right there in Iowa City a hundred years later.
haha! you mean you wouldn't want to trudge through the wilderness pushing and pulling a dang cart weighing a ton, through the worst possible weather conditions for 3.5 months? There weren't exactly any rest stops along the way either. lol.
I spent one winter in Denver before I retreated back to Texas. The whole time I imagined settlers taking one look at the Rocky Mountains and going, "Yeeeah, I'm just going to settle here." Can't say I blame them.
haha! Exactly. I spent a year in Denver also, the mountains are beautiful to look at but to cross them on foot? lol.
I can only imagine the respect the Native Americans must have had for this bunch of hard working immigrants!
howdy tonight Melinda! I think I got a version of esteem that is working on this new computer now. Yes, I would love to know what the Indians thought about those groups pushing their carts across the countryside! lol. No wonder they left them alone!
Yay! I'm so glad that you are getting your new computer all set up.
I knocked my Chromebook off the table and it landed on the corner where the charging cable plugs in. It bent the charging cable to the point where it could no longer be used, so I ordered a new one and it came this afternoon. It will not plug into my Chromebook. I must have damaged the port that it plugs into. I am just sick. Mostly because I had everything all set up exactly the way I need it to be and I relied on it so much for everything. It's not even about having to go buy a new one, which I really can't afford right now with all the Christmas bills, it is the dreaded task of having to set it back up again and remember everything that I had on it.
Oh no! but Melinda it sounds like a repair person should be able to fix that charging port without changing anything else. Do you know a good shop or individual?
Yeah my new computer works great with everything except the newer versions of esteem for some reason but I went back to version 1.11 and it works fine. lol. Versions 2 and up won't work on this or the computer I replaced this one with.
I hope their web based version solves some issues.
Other than the laptop how are things, are you watching some tv? lol
Oh no! but Melinda it sounds like a repair person should be able to fix that charging port without changing anything else. Do you know a good shop or individual?
Yeah my new computer works great with everything except the newer versions of esteem for some reason but I went back to version 1.11 and it works fine. lol. Versions 2 and up won't work on this or the computer I replaced this one with.
I hope their web based version solves some issues.
Other than the laptop how are things, are you watching some tv? lol
I haven't yet! I got busy responding to comments and that led to more comments! I may need to walk away!
I didn't consider repairing the Chromebook. I will look into it. My furnace repairman left happily with my Old 54 inch flat screen TV that I had no idea how I was going to get rid of! It was 10 years old and I don't think Goodwill takes TVs, so I was quite excited that he wanted it!
haha! I love it when both parties get what they want and that was cool to be able to get rid of your old tv that way. Yeah a good repair guy would have that computer repaired in an hour or less and probably cost just $75.
On the comment thing, you're just too friendly. Try being more like me and they'll stop bothering you! lol.
Hahaha... I DO try being like you, but know I never can! 😘
Howdy Janton! First of all I am super happy today because my new laptop arrived and I am already typing on my light up keyboard. I have also touch screen, which I don't really need, but it's fun to scroll down with my finger, lol.
Anyway, now to this sad, yet hilarious story, because I am again laughing my but off!!! You are a comedian!!! You just cant help it can you; making fun of other's misery......just kidding. What the hell they were thinking having so many wives and kids they couldn't feed ??? Oh and Indians probably fell sorry for them??? And then the reenactment and the duct tape, oh my gosh!!! Honestly, you are killing me, lol.
Anyway, I am going to bed now, because I was grocery shopping today and I am exhausted. The new episode of Young Sheldon is out so I will watch it. Oh and check out my new recipe if you like 😊
Howdy Miss Lena! That's great news that you have the new laptop! I bet it's wonderful, sleek and fast, just like you! lol. I also set up my computer last night and it's working very well, not stalls or hangups and freezes, yay! I can have 3 browers full with many tabs open at the same time so it's very efficient.
I'm so glad you liked the post, I figure some people will be bored since there isn't a lot of action yet but that's the way I'm doing it, I want to learn about these men first. And I don't know if many people get my sense of humor but I'm so glad that you do! lol.
The Mormons put a great deal of emphasis on having kids and the women who had alot of kids were highly honored! Of course it practically worked the women to death and kept many families poor but that's the way the church leaders wanted it. I don't know why exactly, need to find a Mormon historian.
I'll go look at that post you did later tonight, thanks for letting me know.
Ah! A new story! A legendary one, no less. Jolly good!
Howdy there sir Vincent! hey did you say you've seen the movie Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid with Paul Newman and Robert Redford?
No, I haven't seen the movie. So, I look forward to reading about it. :-)
sir Vincent! do you guys have Netflix over there? or something similar? and if so, why not? lol. You should watch that movie, it's a classic Western.
Howdy Jonboy. Can I call you Jonboy or you prefer Jon, or @janton
Yes, we have Netflix here, but I am too cheap to pay for it, especially when I don't to because I can watch movies for free on the net. Maybe I will have a look at the movie after you have finished the story.
howdy sir Vincent! you can call me Jonboy which is kinda funny I think. It makes me feel young! lol. It's been a nick name for many years and it fit when I was 40 years younger hhaha!
Oh, so you have Netflix there..well dang near everyone I talk to on steemit has Netflix so eventually I probably will but what\s more interesting is that you are such a penny pincher! lol.. what is your smallest denomination there? That's what you pinch! lol...which is great, Mrs. J is the same way thank God!
But how in the world do you watch movies for free online? Where do I find that site?
No oxen, eh? I suppose those amazing cart donkeys from Spain never really caught on in the US.
Interesting to see snow in your part of the world. Ours is actually melting up here, due to a very odd warm spell. Sunny spots are all muddy and shaded areas still have a little ice and snow.
I thought it was interesting that the church leaders didn't think the people could learn how to handle horses or oxen. I think after a week of working with them they'd have them learned good enough. Maybe it was a cost saving manuever.
Yeah that's probably all the snow we'll see this year. ha! Fine with me.
You mean snow is not typical in there? I thought it is only in California that does not snow in the Americas region?
Anyway, how are you? I remembered dropping by and tell you that I saw an account with rep 83. It was not a good conversation because it was a word war wherein I saw the account but take a look at haejin account... So 80 is not impossible at all. 😂
Dang did I respond to that comment you made about the 83 rep number?
I know about haejin but I hadn't gone to his account for many months and didn't realize he was so high! Yeah I think he's always fighting with people.
The snow, no it never snows here and we're in North Texas. Well, it gets a tiny covering once every few years but never snows in the South part of the state and doesn't snow all the way across the United States unless it's in the mountains of those states. Doesn't snow in Florida, Mississippi, Louisiana, only in the mountians of Alabama, Georgia, New Mexico and Arizona. Texas is much farther South than California so the top half of California gets snow and on the mountains there.
Ok so 80 it is! lol. If steemit lasts I wonder how long that will take?
I think you're blessed then not to have snow like those X meters high that I see on the news and social media. I can only imagine the challenges when those thick snow falls.
Rep 80 is not far to reach. Let's keep going. 😊
haha! rep80 is not far to reach? hey how high is the highest Steemhunt rep? That seems to be working extremely well for you.
I actually miss the snow but it causes alot of misery in the form of people being injured or killed with the ice that comes along with it, plus for most of my life I had to shovel tons of snow out of driveways to get the car out and that isn't fun! It IS beautiful though, when you don't have to drive in it.
I think the snow will be fun for few days but not longer... You miss the snow? Why, where did you come from before staying there in North Texas?
I was raised in Kansas but then lived in Northern Indiana and Northern Ohio. Both states get tons of snow up there, blizzards, many feet per year, etc. It was brutal. I've had a lifetime of snow but I'd still like it if I was in the country and didn't have to leave every day because it's so beautiful. Have you ever been in a place where it snowed? Do you guys have mountains?
When did you move to Texas? I think I'd also prefer the country living than with those snow taller than me!
I've been to Japan last November 2016. Winter was just starting back then so snow was not yet much. We had the experience when we climbed Mt. Fuji but it was so thin still. Just like many spots of those on your photo.
Yes, we have lots of mountains in the Philippines. In the last few years, I noticed on social media the many hiking photos of my friends. It looks like we Filipinos have come to realize to explore more of our resources. 😊
I reckon it would be good fun to do a trip like that....tiring but good experience with your kids.
Great to live in a country where things like that still happen and its safe enough to do.
Most countries they would be hit by thieves and crooks
Howdy sir towjam! yes sir, I don't know why they weren't hit by thieves and crooks, maybe they had security with them, I should have researched that more. Thanks so much for reading and commenting!
I always enjoy your articles, so I need to thank you :)
well howdy sir towjam and thank you too for reading and commenting, you have great posts too and on a fascinating variety of topics!
Ah thank you so much! I try to do interesting and varied subjects, and these interest me.
In the beginning I wasnt sure which path I should take!! I am comfy now with it....
howdy today sir towjam! well sir...you mean you were looking for a specific niche to write about? I was doing a large variety also but then when I started doing stories about cowboys and Indians I got requests to do more so that kind of put me into that niche.
But the variety works great I think, because people have no idea what to expect.
Well you have taken this and run with it well! It definitely seems that people have responded well to it too....well done!
Hi, @janton!
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howdy there steem-plus! Thanks so much for the upvote!
Oh, how I'm looking forward to this. I've told you I followed the boys more than just a little, and I really like the backstory you've told today.
The migration west was just purely something. My family left Vuhginia (What is now West Virginia) right at the start of the Civil War. My great great decided to fight for the North and moved his family to Illinois for the war years. Then they ambled west, but they went all the way, to the Pacific Ocean. Took two generations for them to get the whole deal done. My grandfather was born in Kansas on that trip.
Thanks for starting this journey. Brigham Young must have been a masochist for devising that mode of travel. That would have made the easiest part of the trip incredibly hard.
Howdy sir bigtom13! How interesting...it took your ancestors many years to finally make it to the West coast? Wow, think of all the stories about that adventure! I wonder if it was about the cost regarding the hand carts verses oxen or mules or horses?
It's fairly incomprehensible to me what those people had to go through with no bathroom facilities and so forth, no way to take showers...hopefully they came near lakes, ponds and rivers but in the winter time who wants a frigid bath? lol. I'm sure there are diaries of some of them that wrote about it, I've love to read those. I'm sure the Mormon church has many articles about those treks.
Thank you sir for the great comment as always!
Most of my real knowledge is about the Oregon Trail. My last ex's parents farm was literally on the Oregon Trail near Ione, Oregon. The Society has a whole bunch of diaries and letters that are pretty amazing.
I have chipped ice a few times to wash my face and brush my teeth. Mostly on hunting trips in my youth.
Sanitary habits then were somewhat different than we use now...
My people mostly waited on the train to get there once and for all. My great grandfather did a hitch with the 7th cav on the way. He was too young for the Civil War. That's why my Grandfather was born in Kansas. My mom told lots of stories about her grandparents. They all lived on the same farmstead during the depression. Grandpa worked and my great grandparents did truck farming, notably green beans.
A couple of other thoughts.
Most of the country those people traveled through didn't have many trees. Firewood had to be hard to come by, making meal prep and washing warm hard to do, too.
They didn't travel in the winter. If they did, they died. I was at Independence Rock, Wyoming this summer. It was so named because the travelers on the Oregon Trail wanted to be there by July 4th to be able to make it through the Blue Mountains before the snows came. A lot of people died there.
Howdy sir bigtom13! how interesting, wow, so your mom had lots of stories that she had heard about. Have you done any posts about the history of the Oregon trail?
Only one big mustache?!
howdy blacklux! I know...it's a shocking mistake and probably the main reason for their downfall, good observation, I bet no one else caught that!
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thank you so much steemitbloggers, God bless you for helping so many of the family!
You got a 28.50% upvote from @ocdb courtesy of @janton!
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well howdy there ocdb! Thanks so much for the upvote.
No tv or Steem and the result is 13 kids. I think the re-enactments are nuts as who would do that for fun? I think there are more crazy people around than we think.
haha! howdy today sir cryptoandcoffee! yeah in the Mormon church women with many children were highly honored and women were expected to have as many kids as possible so I guess they did! I'm sure there is much information about the reenactments that explain their purpose, I should have researched that more but by the time I found out about it I was running out of time.
The things we learn in steemit @janton You didn't know it got so hot in Australia and I didn't know it snowed in Texas! You share some amazing facts about the life and times of 'The Wild Bunch' and those living in that era.
We are fortunate to benefit from your interest in history and it is going to be fascinating to find out what does make someone become an outlaw? I guess I shall have to read on because now I am wondering the same thing myself.
howdy again trudeehunter! Well I try to ascertain that in every story I do about outlaws and it usually becomes evident but sometimes it makes no sense but it's interesting to look at, at least for me. I'm glad you're interested too. Thank you so much for the kind words!
Always a pleasure! It's great that you are able to bring the wild west into the present but in an intriguing and interesting manner. It is clear that you have a passion for it and that is what draws your readers in.
Butch is an interesting one
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Howdy sir blanchy! yes sir he sure is but he let himself get pulled into a life of crime, I can understand it though, back then you could make a ton of money that way if you were smart about it. He should have moved to Ireland and married an Irish lass, that would have solved all his criminal temptation problems!
Great book called star of the sea about the coffin ships going to the states around then
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Oh yes Star of the Sea, I didn't know Ireland had any good authors but I guess there were a few who learned how to write! lol. Yes 1847 is about 40 years earlier than my story but any novel written by an Irish author is history making and one which involves America is even more noteworthy. Thanks for bringing this to my attention sir blanchy, seriously, it sounds like a fascinating read! I hope I can get to it someday, perhaps make a series of posts out of it.
So glad I stumbled upon your story, gosh I never heard of pushcarts before! And people re-enact pulling those carts, quite crazy, but fascinating story as always! Heading over to the next chapter now ;)
Howdy there lizelle! Thank you for the kind words. This one is kinda slow at first because I wanted to give the background information but more action will come later. Thanks so much for reading and commenting! I'm going over to your blog to see what's going on. I think I'll do that right now!
Butch and Sundance are the most famous of the American bandits, here in South Africa. Is it the same there or is it simply the stories that we heard more of @janton? They look so upper class and sophisticated in that first photo! Well done on getting such a superb post the recognition you deserve
Howdy there buckaroo! Well they are pretty famous here, mostly because of the movie. Jesse James is as famous too. That is such a great picture with all of them isn't it? They were very unusual in that they were very curteous robbers! lol.
Oh I haven't ever gotten any recognition for my little posts. I just got tired of seeing everyone zoom past me in rep score by buying votes so I bought some last week, that's all. I just wanted to at least get to rep60 so I gave myself a boost by buying votes.
Most of the leaders on here are spending 20 to 40 steem each day buying votes to increase the speed of their rep score growth. I don't have much steem so I'm about done buying.
@janton Haha the re-enactments sound fun in theory but in practice, it's actually super backbreaking. XD
And, that community seems like the kind that's isolated and closed off from the outside world...
Howdy there joeylim! I agree, the re-enactments would be brutal! I'd never make it, let alone the actual journey, they were much tougher back then!
Yes, the idea was to create their own isolated community so they'd have freedom to conduct themselves how they saw fit.
Where are you located? Thanks so much for commenting!
Okay, I had no idea that he was a Morman! I had to read that part over about a dozen times for it to stick. I wonder if this is why he had so many "rules", if I am remembering his character in the movie. He was always telling how they had to do things according to "rules". Hope I am remembering right.
Okay, I am sitting down with a huge cup of coffee and getting ready to spend some time on this series. It's gonna be a good one, I can tell... well, all of yours are good. haha!
Ren
Howdy again Ren! yes, no one would have ever guessed that he was raised as a devout Mormon! He gives the church a bad name! lol. I need to watch the movie again, haven't seen it in probably 30 years! So what you said sounds familiar but since I'm doing this series I need to watch it. The whole thing is probably on youtube.
This is great! I wish I could re-steem this. I guess it's too old? Or maybe I re-steemed to much stuff already today.
Howdy there optout! Thanks so much, yes it was a really fun story to tell and it was easy because it was so interesting, I didn't have to be creative at all! lol.. thanks for taking the time to read this series.
Still a good lead in. Yes, lets see if we can learn from history as to what pattern we can see leading people to a life of violence and crime. Sounds interesting there partner.
howdy squirrelbait! well you and I might be unusual but I find it interesting to look at what got criminals into their lifestyles. Like Cole Younger, it was easy to see how he turned into one but some seem to just be greedy or have no conscious and others have a grudge against society and authority figures.
What made you be so rebellious? lol.. just teasing. but in a way you are! a good way.
Funny how activist and criminal get interwoven sometimes. Like eccentric and insane. If learning about human nature is unusual, then societies are doomed to failure.
dang don't say that! lol.. we're doomed to failure then! It's like studying history so we don't repeat the same mistakes but that hasn't stopped us from repeating the same mistakes. lol. sad truth about the human race.