This story is based on a practical case that I experienced recently. I already had a feeling about all this, but let's just say that this example has clearly highlighted the ins and outs of this evolution of the world. Perhaps more so for the Western world, and that's " lucky " in quotes, because it's the world I live in and have the most experience of.
The reflections presented here will be essentially of an economic, ecological and modestly philosophical nature. We will also talk about technical and scientific progress and its purpose, which can sometimes be difficult to grasp or perceive. The analyses delivered in this article will mainly concern a field in which I am particularly interested, gardening with all that such a broad and general term encompasses. To clarify my thinking a little, I would say that what interests me most is permaculture research, a practice that aims to take into account all the different organisms and their needs, rather than just human desires. Whether these desires are aesthetic, productive or financial.
Of course, in this practice, weed killers and other chemical products are banned and the general idea is to find a balance between biodiversity, the nutritional and structural quality of the soil and the food needs of all the species present on a given territory, one of these species being, among others, the human gardener.
But let me tell you the story of this research. Research that is far from over, but that doesn't stop me from talking about it.
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This is what these machines look like, which at the time were only powered by arms, but which exist today of course powered by an engine and various fuels (mainly electricity and oil). This brings us to the source of my reflection today.
We have found a house in the country with a rather large piece of land (more than one hectare) and I am already starting to inquire about the more concrete applications that I could (finally !) give to my desires, aspirations and knowledge on subjects related to Nature and that living in the city, I have never been able to really put into practice. For an article that summarizes what forms our installation plans could take, you can go here. But I might as well tell you already what our idea would be. The project is to make a garden forest, an ecosystem with layers of plants that are different in size, type and need, but complementary at the same time. The basic principle is, as the name suggests, to reproduce the symbiotic exchanges between the trees - and sometimes the struggle- with other plants.
So here's the plan...
So let's get to the straw chopper. Another principle of permaculture is that it is desirable to improve the soil year after year, season after season. As plants grow, they use minerals and nutrients and if these are not replenished, the soil becomes poorer with each harvest. This is why the soil should never be bare ! Indeed, do you know of a fertile place where the soil is completely visible? In the forest this is not the case, and this is what we should be inspired by...
You are obviously beginning to feel the arrival of the straw chopper in this whole story !
This machine was originally used to cut straw to feed smaller animals, chickens and rabbits. But over the last few decades, the demand for this type of machine has picked up again and the market has not really adapted to this demand, which is certainly niche, but energetic is the demand in the niche ! From now on, the idea is to finely cut a mixture of green and dry vegetation to improve the soil and at the same time better conserve the moisture in it (by limiting evaporation in particular).
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At the moment, all I have managed to find for new products is an Indian online market. Take a look at the link and you'll see the different machines, again compared to a hand operated machine.
In Europe, or at least in France, all the straw choppers I can find are on second-hand websites. The funny thing is that when you arrive on the site, for about 35 listings, there are more than 20 that are actually requests from people looking for this type of product. The other 10 are offers, but the choppers that are offered there cost several hundred euros, and more than a thousand for some. Indeed, these have been restored which explains part of their cost. But not only that, the real reason here is the rarity of these machines whereas a century or two ago, they were found in every farm. The last 5 entries are antiques, rusty as can be and more likely to be displayed next to a bunch of brightly colored garden gnomes.
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But for the time being, there is no way to find a single new machine in Europe. Nobody seems to build body powered machines anymore. Even bicycles are going electric! And that's the bottom line for me. We got used to the idea that energy was abundant, available and cheap. And this is actually not true.
In reality, this may be the case with techniques such as those developed by Nikola Tesla, but this would not help the powerful... But that's another subject, or at least another angle of approach !
I will try to give you one of my conceptions of human life. As a preamble, let me tell you that I am not religious, but first and foremost spiritual. I believe that our beings are composed of three things: a soul, a spirit and a body. Neglect one of these three parts and the others will inevitably suffer. Things need balance to be viable and it has become clear that things in the western, solely materialistic and capitalist way are not and no longer viable at all.
For me, in everything, the main idea is to observe Nature and to find the balance that allows everything to find its place. I'm not a fan of lithium batteries and yet I love the Internet and new technologies. I love this blockchain and I feel like I belong there. Could HIVE be replaced by something manual powered ?
Not really, or it wouldn't be the same thing...
Of course, I expected to find none of these machines still produced in Europe, but it's mainly because unless you buy them in Africa or India, nobody, no supplier sells them ! If you find one, please tell me haha !
A few years ago, our president in France - increasingly unpopular - declared that the ecological transition would not be synonymous with de-growth. I think he's half wrong. For my part, I do not oppose progress and the means of the past. Why oppose things anyway ? Can't we dream of villages that are physically and virtually connected to the rest of the world and whose inhabitants use the best aspects of current and future technologies combined with those of the past ?
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I know I've thrown a lot of ideas around a bit in the course of this article and that's probably due to my mind working through root networks and associations of ideas. I'm not making excuses for what might seem like a draft to some, but I also think it's a good way to leave spaces without them being missing so that your own mind as a reader can be an actor and not a spectator of this reflection.
I hope you enjoy and are interested in this one and thank you very much if you get this far, for your time to read and the ideas you may want to share !
Take care of yourself and your loved ones, I wish you an excellent day,
Obviously not a gram of AI in all this.
All these images are not mine, but I wish some were.
Cette histoire part d'un cas concret que j'ai fait l'expérience récemment. J'avais déjà un sentiment par rapport à tout cela, mais on va dire que cet exemple a clairement mis en lumière les tenants et aboutissants de cette évolution du monde. Peut-être davantage pour le monde occidental et cela "tombe bien" entre guillemets, car c'est le monde dans lequel je vis et dont j'ai la plus grande expérience.
Les réflexions présentées ici seront essentiellement d'ordre économique, écologique, et modestement philosophiques. Nous parlerons aussi du progrès technique et scientifique et de sa finalité qui peut parfois être difficile à bien saisir ou percevoir. Les analyses livrées dans cet article concerneront principalement un domaine auquel je m'intéresse particulièrement, le jardinage avec tout ce qu'englobe un terme aussi large et général. Pour préciser un peu ma pensée, je dirai que ce qui m'intéresse avant tout, c'est la recherche en permaculture, une pratique qui vise à prendre en compte tous les différents organismes et leurs besoins, plutôt que les seuls désirs humains. Que ces désirs soient d'ordre esthétiques, productifs ou encore financiers.
Bien entendu, dans cette pratique-là, les désherbants et autres produits chimiques sont bannis et l'idée générale est donc de trouver un équilibre entre la biodiversité, la qualité nutritive et structurelle du sol et les besoins alimentaires de toute les espèces présentes sur un territoire donné, une de ces espèces étant entre autres, l'humain-jardinier.
Mais laissez moi vous raconte le récit de cette recherche. Recherche, autant vous le dire, qui est loin d'être terminée, ce qui ne m'empêche pas déjà d'en parler.
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Voilà à quoi ressemble ces machines qui existaient à l'époque seulement muent à la force des bras, mais qui existent aujourd'hui bien entendu actionnées par un moteur et différents combustibles (électricité et pétrole majoritairement). C'est là que l'on en arrive à la source de ma reflexion d'aujourd'hui.
Nous avons trouvé une maison à la campagne avec notamment un assez grand terrain (+ d'un hectare) et je commence déjà à me renseigner sur les applications plus concrètes que je pourrais (enfin !) donner à mes envies, aspirations et connaissances sur des sujets liés à la Nature et que vivant en ville, je n'ai jamais pu vraiment mettre en pratique. Pour un article qui résume quels formes pourraient prendre nos plans d'installation, vous pouvez aller faire un tour par ici. Mais autant vous dire déjà quelle serait notre idée. Le projet est de faire une forêt-jardin, un écosystème avec des strates de plantes différentes par leurs tailles, types et besoins et complémentaires à la fois. Le principe de base est comme son nom l'indique, de reproduire les échanges symbiotiques entre les arbres - et parfois la lutte - avec les autres végétaux.
Voilà quel est le plan...
Passons dès lors au hache-paille. Un des autre principe de la permaculture est qu'il est souhaité et souhaitable d'améliorer son sol d'année en année, saison après saison. En poussant les végétaux utilisent des minéraux et des nutriments et si on ne les renouvelle pas, le sol s'appauvrit à chaque récolte. C'est pourquoi la terre ne doit jamais être nue ! En effet, connaissez-vous un endroit fertile où la terre est totalement visible ? En forêt ce n'est pas le cas en tout cas et c'est de cela que nous devons nous inspirer...
Vous commencez évidemment à sentir l'arrivée du hache-paille dans toute cette histoire !
Cette machine servait à l'origine à découper de la paille pour nourrir les plus petits animaux, poules et lapins. Mais depuis quelques décennies, la demande s'est relancé pour ce type de machines s'est relancé et le marché ne s'est pas réellement adapté à cette demande, certes de niche, mais qui est énergique dans la niche ! Dorénavant, l'idée est de couper finement un mélange de végétaux verts et secs pour améliorer son sol et à la fois mieux conserver l'humidité en son sein (en limitant l'évaporation notamment).
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Pour le moment, tout ce que j'ai réussi à trouver pour des produits neufs c'est un marché en ligne indien. Allez faire un tour via le lien, vous pourrez ainsi vous rendre compte des différentes machines, toujours par rapport à une utilisation manuelle.
En Europe ou en tout cas en France, tout les haches-paille que je trouve sont sur des sites de ventes d'occasion. Le plus drôle c'est que lorsque l'on arrive sur le site, pour environ 35 annonces, il y en a plus de 20 qui sont en fait des demandes de gens qui recherchent ce type de produit. Les 10 autres, ce sont des offres, mais les haches-pailles qui sont proposés-là coûtent plusieurs centaines d'euros, et lus d'un millier pour certains. En effet, ceux-ci ont été restaurés ce qui explique une partie de leur coût. Mais pas seulement, la vraie raison ici, c'est la rareté de ces machines alors que voici un siècle ou deux, celles-ci se trouvaient dans toutes les fermes. Les 5 dernières annonces, ce sont des antiquités, rouillées à souhait et que l'on expose plus probablement à côté d'une troupe de nains de jardins aux couleurs criardes.
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Mais pour le coup, pas moyen de trouver seule de ces machine neuve en Europe. Plus personne ne semble construire des machines qui fonctionnent à l'énergie du corps. Même les vélos deviennent électriques..! Et c'est là pour moi le fond du problème. Nous nous sommes habitués à l'idée que l'énergie était abondante, disponible et peu coûteuse. Et c'est en fait faux.
En réalité c'est peut-être le cas avec des techniques comme celles développées par Nikola Tesla, mais cela n'arrangerait en rien les puissants... Mais il s'agit là d'un autre sujet, ou en tout cas d'un autre angle d'approche !
Je vais tenter de vous donner une de mes conceptions de la vie humaine. En préambule, laissez-moi vous dire que je ne suis pas religieux, mais avant tout spirituel. Je pense que nos êtres sont composés de trois choses : d'une âme, d'un esprit et d'un corps. Négligez l'une de ces trois parties, et les autres en pâtiront inévitablement. Les choses ont besoin d'équilibre pour être viables et il est devenu évident que les choses à la sauce occidentale, uniquement matérialiste et capitaliste ne sont pas et plus viables du tout.
Pour moi, en toute chose, l'idée est d'observer la Nature et de déceler la part d'équilibre qui permet à chaque chose de trouver sa place. Je ne suis pas un adepte des batteries lithium et pour autant, j'adore Internet et les nouvelles technologies. J'adore cette blockchain et j'ai l'impression d'y avoir ma place. Est-ce que cela pourrait-être remplacé par quelque chose de manuel ?
Pas vraiment, ou bien ce ne serait alors plus la même chose...
Bien entendu, je m'attendais à ne trouver aucune de ces machines encore produites en Europe, mais c'est surtout qu'à moins de les acheter en Afrique ou en Inde, personne, aucun fournisseur n'en vend ! Si vous en trouvez-un, franchement dites le moi haha !
Il y a quelques années, notre président en France - de plus en plus impopulaire - a déclaré que la transition écologique ne serait pas synonyme de décroissance. Je pense qu'il a à moitié tort. De mon côté, je n'oppose pas le progrès et les moyens du passé. Pourquoi opposer les choses d'ailleurs ? Ne pouvons-nous rêver de villages connectés physiquement et virtuellement au reste du monde et dont les habitants utiliseraient les meilleurs aspects des technologies actuelles, à venir alliées à de celles du passé ?
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Je sais que j'ai lancé beaucoup d'idées, un peu dans tous les sens au cours de cette article et c'est probablement en raison de mon esprit qui fonctionne par réseau et associations d'idées. Je ne cherche pas d'excuse pour ce qui pourrait ressembler à un brouillon pour certains, mais je pense aussi que c'est une bonne manière de laisser des vides sans que ceux-ci soient des manques afin que votre propre esprit de lecteur soit acteur et non spectateur de cette réflexion.
J'espère que celle-ci vous aura plût et intéressé et mille mercis si vous parvenez jusqu'ici, pour votre temps de lecture et les idées que vous voudrez éventuellement partager !
Prenez soin de vous et de vos proches, je vous souhaite une excellente journée,
Évidemment pas un gramme d'AI dans tout ceci.
Toutes ces images ne sont pas les miennes, mais j'aurai préféré que pour certaines, ce soit le cas.
I just published this in the biggest second hand website in Portugal ; )
YEAH !
Many thanks 😉 !
It made me super curious ^^
I was also wondering, do you have an equivalent machine for your own garden ?
No worries. I will be happy to help if we find one !
no, I do not have one. maybe I´ll find two ; )
That's kind of what I was thinking hehe !
Have a good afternoon 🌱✌️
I got a message that the publication was removed as they only allow sell ones, not a looking for ones.
sorry. I´ll keep trying anyway.
https://leofinance.io/threads/@thetimetravelerz/re-leothreads-n5sxkxdv
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Hey @anttn
Finding these machines should not be a problem how many do you want and are you looking for a manual or a motorize version?
Though these are heavy pieces of metal and shipping via post may cost a lot but let us take it one step at a time lets zero in on a model first.
I was just thinking about this as you are in India... What region are you in already ? One of the points in my article was that you can't find any, new or used, in Europe, and dozens of new ones in some parts of the world, mainly in India, Africa and South America...
Yes, that's what I thought, the taxes and shipping costs may indeed be more important than the price of the item, but it's good to find out first :)
In the end, I'm looking for one without a motor and that can be operated by hand... that way, even if there is a power cut, I'm independent ^^
Have a good Sunday dear !
Hello Dear @anttn
Would it be OK if we take this discussion to discord (sent you a request )
Hope you have a great Sunday Too :)
Hi dear !
I'll catch you soon on Discord :) Somehow it's no longer working on my computer...
Have a good day and see you soon !
Dear @anttn
Not an issue the only idea of connecting via discord was that in case you need me to talk to a local vendor and communicate the details of the product to you in real time.
Sharing all the details as comments can work too though not sure how spontaneous the communication would be.
For someone who is ready to go to La Chapelle to find the price of a pastry for me this is the least I can do ;)
Take care dear @anttn
It would be a pleasure ! Also I don't want to bother you with this. For the moment I think I'll look for what I can find here in Europe second hand, but let's keep the idea in mind if it's really too complicated here :D
But do you have shop that sell those type of machines near your place ?
I'm also replying to your other comment here and I'll be spending today and the next few days at the Chapelle, I'll be happy to go and do a little research on the traces of this feast haha! If you manage to find the street on a map and/or send me a picture (or the name) of this dessert, I think I should be able to find it ^^!
Thanks again for everything, I hope you have a nice day and that you're well 🌱
Near my house ? Nah I am in the middle of a city far from the the farms and fields so most of these shops would be set in the vicinity of places where they do farming.
However this does not stop me to keep researching and looking for info that can be relevant.
I would keep an eye for anything that I come across and ask my friends in case someone knows some place selling these machines.
That looks like a good plan. I wish I were there so I could go around without a map of my google assistant. Who needs it when you have @anttn around ?
I would not mind coming there and exploring the area again if you are around to guide me. Though a starting point could be Krishna Bhawan restaurant at La Chapelle
it is run by Srilankans and so are those pastry shops.
The Srilankan community is pretty close knit and would be able to give directions without any trouble.
Just a thought.
The shop I have in mind had no place to sit and had lots of pastries trays looks like they were into supplying to some other establishments.
Take care dear @anttn and stay safe
Have a great day
What a beautiful piece machinery.
I always knew you were an Old Soul.
haha.
Hey @bigorna1 !
For sure !
I always feel more comfortable with people that have two or three times my age.
Now it's questioning about my real age... ^^
If by chance you've advices on how to find one, don't hesitate haha
I hope you're doing good dear 🤞 take good care
I will try to see if I can find one around here.
Portugal is a box full of treasures !
Imagine you find one (or two ?), this would be amazing to organize a travel to meet in Portugal :) Even without that, I would love to discover more your area, what you have shown has made me very curious every time !
I´d love to find one. and regardless, i´d love to meet in some point in time.
Yes, you are right, anyway 😉
That’s what I will create a forest garden… all in harmony with each other 😉 one day hahaha 🤣
It’s indeed a shame they don’t produce hand powered tools anymore, you have to search second hand markets… maybe you find what you need. Or talk to other older farmers in the area where you bought the house. I’m sure lots of machinery are somewhere in a corner of many gardens.
I hope you'll ! But I know you've the ressources for that and the will and I'm crossing my fingers for this to come in a not so late future :))
Indeed, this is saying a lot about physical work and energy availability... Like those machines can produce 200/300kg of good mulch by hour, no matter you have electricity or not ! Sounds like a dream to me haha !
I will definitely follow your advices when we'll be well setup there !
How are you doing lately ? I hope the moving is not to challenging again, or time consuming... even I also know you've the inner ressources !
Thank you so much @anttn 👋🏻😊 let’s hope within a year. As all goes well, I move 7 May to our next rental in Ireland. Then we start looking for a cottage to buy. We can stay up to 1,5 years in the rental. So perfect timing to find the right place, with garden/ land.
It does sound like a dream indeed… let’s go old school 😎
I’m tired and busy hahaha just got back Sunday from 2 weeks of terracotta tiling (am about to post that today, somehow I did manage to post a walk too last Wednesday… before that a long time not) all wrong timing right in the middle of our move.
Now packing up the last boxes and wrapping items. Wednesday the movers come. We have one day to clean the house and put the owners belongings back in their place. Than drive to the in-laws again over 2 days south… to finish tiling again hahaha 🤣
I hop on the ferry ⛴️ 6 May… overnight and hopefully land in the rental the 7th. 🤞🏻🤞🏻🤞🏻
So you can say it’s challenging this move hehehe 🤭
Soon it will be done and next move after this should be it for a while… 😊
Have a great day my friend 👋🏻😎
This sounds like a good plan ! So the cottage you'll search will be in Ireland too ?
Just had a closer on your terracotta tiling session, perfect result !
I'll cross my fingers for you and hopping that the plan works as expected :)
Have a good weekend dear @littlebee4 😇
It will be 😎 yes, it is in Ireland. The seasons there are good for growing a lot. A poly tunnel will add most veggies in the colder wetter months.
Thank you so much, much appreciated!
Let’s see, as so far plans changed lately hehehe 🤭
But Ireland we can stay in without visas. So should be fine for a while. I need some rest… and just be.
Work in a garden… start painting and drawing again and be in nature.
You know, the future can always change. So let’s do one day at the time. 😉
Have a good weekend too 👋🏻😘 enjoy!
It does indeed look better from all points of view! I can't wait for you :))
Sorry to hang up the train so late, I was in gif training haha ^^^
I wish you good luck for the next steps and a very nice day, take care 😇😘
Do you have friends in Colombia...?
they have these machines there ! and in Venezuela. maybe talk to @sirenahippie
check them out:
and you can also get creative:
I will keep an eye open here on my end.
wishing us all a peaceful weekend !
Oh, you're right. I need to check more this part of the world too !
I saw the one with the bike, several versions in fact but I also really like the washing machine bike version 😉
But it seems complicated to find a good one just hand-operated :)
Have a good weekend too 😊
Friends in India ?
I just found some there too..
https://www.tradeindia.com/products/mini-light-power-toka-machine-5957981.html
Oh nice !
a brand new manual one costs 4,500 Rupies (50€).
shame the customs would cost probably as much.
Yes, and it's also difficult to know how good those are without checking in reality... a bit the reason why I would even prefer an old one still working after years of usage !
I totally agree.
but, at the same time, I love to see that in some places you can still buy them brand new.
and in this case, considering what they are, I doubt you could go very wrong ; )
They are also on www.indiamart.com
they are called Toka machine
I love this "primitive" aspect of India !
Yeah, me too ! I will ckeck indianmart a bit deeper..
Also I could maybe ask Hindavi :)
Many thanks ! I hope you're doing good :-)
Thanks ! I wish you a good weekend 😊