Debt is a funny thing.
Not only because it has a silent B, but also because there is a certain level of trust in the process of it. At least, there was. Originally it comes from Latin and means "thing owed" and I assume due to human nature, it has been around a lot longer than financial currencies. When someone does something for you, when they help you, you are indebted to them. They might not expect a payment in return, but there is still that feeling, isn't there?
This is the timeline of US debt, where in 60 odd years, it has gone from zero, to forty billion. But perhaps what is more incredible, is that it has doubled in the space of about 10 years.
When looking at numbers this large, it is pretty hard to really understand what it means in terms of reality, but 40 billion dollars buys forty million, million dollar houses. There are about a million homeless people in the US on any given night. But it might also be easier to understand if breaking what this amount is for an individual US citizen. Each US citizen owes almost 120,000 in national debt. But, that really isn't fair, is it? Not everyone has a job or pays tax, and the money is coming from taxpayers, and *future taxpayers.
Each taxpayer owes 285,857 in national debt.
That amount grows by about 15 dollars a day.
5,475 dollars a year.
I wonder though, with all this money going around, being spent on improving American lives in some way, Making America great again - what experience does the average American get for their money? Have things really improved? Are the roads better, the schools, the parks? Do people feel safer on the streets, is there more money for more people to take holidays, buy some luxuries without using a credit card? Is your health better, those you care about improving?
Are Americans better off?
For a little thought experiment, imagine you have a credit card that you never have to pay back. Every year you have 5,475 dollars to spend on it. Would you be able to improve your life with it? No imagine everyone in the country had the same card. What would happen in the economy?
Granted, people are idiots with their money in general, but so are governments.
And it isn't their money.
As said, debt comes with a certain level of trust that the debt will be paid off, but let's face it, no government is ever going to be able to manage to pay down the US debt from this point, which means, it shouldn't be trusted. But as I was saying to a friend last night, all governments should be going heavily into debt.
Like, extreme debt.
But instead of enriching the few, they should use that debt money to do all they can to improve the social structure and lives of their citizens. Make the country a brilliant place to live, even though the debt keeps climbing. Why?
Because, the system isn't sustainable.
It has to collapse. And that collapse, at least from an economic standpoint, will be catastrophic. The type of thing that will not only start WWIII, but keep it going for IV and V as well. And the debt model, all these "IOUs" that countries have with each other, will be worthless. So all the countries that have been enacting austerity measures to pay down their debt, will have punished their people for years and be in the same position financially that all the countries that had extreme debt like the US model that keeps it operating as "the largest economy". The difference is, some people in the high debt countries got extremely wealthy, and then transferred that wealth into ownership that wasn't attached to currency.
Like a bunker to ride out WWIII, IV and V.
Now, factor in the impact of automation and artificial intelligence on the economy and realise how precarious the legacy economy is, and that it is fast approaching an unrecoverable failure point - and there is no save along the way. It is careening down a steep hill, toward a sheer cliff.
So, I think we have to question a system that keeps on printing and spending money, but there doesn't seem to be any positive development we can experience from it. Imagine going hungry to a restaurant with your credit card, ordering, paying, and leaving without getting anything to eat.
And still tipping for the service.
(I fucking hate tip culture).
If your business can't afford to pay staff properly, the business isn't viable.
(And they will still expect tips for their robots)
Yet while the average person isn't seeing any clear benefits, the rich keep on getting richer. So, how is that possible, when they are meant to get richer by selling things that make our lives better?
The silent B stands for Bullshit.
The debt system is fucked.
Stop defending it.
Taraz
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debt is such an interesting one...
been watching some fantastic docos on the history of money and money theory. Really interesting stuff. no accounting stuff, but things on global economy and what not.
Debt being something that is discussed a lot.
key idea they say is.... that is your borrow 100k and pay it back the next day, they the money is about the same amount. however after 20 years 100K is not such a large amount anymore... its play money, and then you factor in the interest and if you got a deduction on taxes for having it... (then it costs less) and then at the end of that 20 years of borrowing are you better off... blah blah blah... its all very interesting.
now all that being said.... im not saying i agree at all... just saying some of the "money science" behind it all is interesting. That isn't quite the same thing.
And i agree... have they used the "debt" to improve America... to make it "great again?"
Here in Australia they media would have us believe absolutely not. They have NOT improved it. They have not made America great again with all the debt.
i ALSO hate tip culture... grrrr..... some of the online service things here in australia have started asking for tips out of habit. i HATE this. When out at a restaurant sometimes we will leave a tiny bit on a tab for exceptional service, but its not expected at all.
sorry... as usual im not sure my comment went where i meant it... however... no point deleting it now i got to the end.. lol
Look at how Australia has used its "public finances" in recent times. Things getting better there? What ends up happening is while not the true causes, when people are suffering they blame every little issue that adds immediate pain. But that immediate pain is a symptom of a far deeper and longer-running illness.
oh no, you are not wrong there either :-)
That being said, i would still vastly choose here to live over US. "The lesser of two evils"
I sometimes wonder if there has ever been a "good time" to live in the world. Like a time where most people in the society were comfortable and happy.
Im feeling there might not be one, and every generation feels like THEY should be it and are not... or they are worse than the generation before and maybe they are not. Im not sure? What do you think?
maybe a topic for a post? lol
blingit
Debt is a financial instrument. When it is properly used it is the best wealth building tool on individual, business and government level.
National debt in America is a political talking point, but in reality it is one of our biggest competitive advantages. I love cheap debt, at one point of my life I was over a million dollars in debt. But I should have borrowed at least three times as much I would have been wealthy if I did, but my conservative nature as usual let me down. Right now I don't have any loans except owing my wife around 30k that I was short on the last transaction. But it is not a real debt as I fully cover our 10k monthly family budget...
Sure. But it is also a tool used to impoverish the masses right? Can it be used to build wealth for the masses?
Yes. The talk is just nonsense.
I think debt could be totally used to build wealth for the masses and for a long period of time in American history it was used to build wealth for the masses, but things have changed over time and recently with this administration everything is being used as an opportunity to build wealth for our king and his surroundings...
I think that the past was the start of the end. Essentially, the wealth will keep consolidating, and we are seeing the tailend of it now - where it is super concentrated. Wealth is not attached to work anymore - it was before.
I see a lot of people able to make it from the ground up into wealth in America still... Though the economy right now is terrible, a lot worse than the news would suggest... companies a quietly cutting people...
This could go on for centuries.
It has gone on for centuries, but will it now? The world has somewhat changed in technology and also in culture.
Also.
Potus
With a jackass like that in charge of the USA and the way the electorate (not just maga) eat up his crsp is mind-boggling to most people.
Austerity for the tax paying public tax breaks for the wealthy.
I blame Ayn Rand and her minions.
Milton Friedman and his Monetarism bullshit.
Margaret Thatcher & Ronald Reagan and everyone since then.
Trickle down... my arse 😂👍
Japan has been in debt for over 40 years.
Debt is a wealth building tool, that ultimately takes from most to give to the few.
The problem is that their are increasing numbers trying to be the few. Look at the number of get rich schemes out there.
It's grown exponential since the birth of the Internet.
The days of the snake oil salesman on a wagon going from town to town are long gone. Replaced by the likes of Andrew Tate.
We have been screwed in America since Woodrow Wilson. 1913 created the income tax and the Fed. !BBH
But look at all the greatness that has been built since! The poverty, the violence, the drug addiction!
!BBH
You don't sound the b?
I'll probably read some earlier post you wrote about health in a bit (the feed being reverse chronological and all) which will remind me about it more but I got vaguely reminded of an article I read sometime in the last few days that was pushing for making access to sports or health supporting services or something cheaper or free as it would save ludicrous amounts of money in the future.
I don't know how that's going as I'm an extremely passive news consumer (I put news sources back on my rss feed after my brain developed enough to stop being so reactionary to everything and I don't always have time or inclination to follow up on anything unless I find it particularly interesting or at least compelling) but it's more indication of some shift.
Do you? :D
I was writing a month or two back about having health services (fitness, nutrition etc) come to the house and families to help people out. Plus, it creates jobs that matter.
Kind of? I make the shape of the b so I guess I hear it because I can feel it but maybe no one else can XD
That was probably the one I was thinking of when I encountered the news article.
I wouldn't believe that a country like the USA should owe, not to talk of that much. The way see them, one would believe that they are self-sufficient.
But are they owing this much because of the many wars they engage in?
They are self-sufficient. They know they will never pay it off. Any conversation around it is just political games.
No. That is just a fraction of it. Most of it is because of how they run their economy to discount things to keep them consuming.
Good day.
This discussion just enlightened me more and change my perspective over the we view the developed countries. We from the third world country think that the more developed countries can borrow a dime.
On the issue of borrowing to subsidize their economy, that sounds fair to me. That means they are more citizen minded. They enter into that debt to make life easy and sustain their citizen. We lack such in our African region. In fact, they make us bleed while they amasse everything to themselves.
Thank you for this enlightenment.
A different perspective:
America’s debt situation is a good reminder that borrowing itself isn’t necessarily the problem; the real question is what the borrowed money is used for and whether the economy can sustain the debt.
The U.S. debt shows that even the world’s strongest economies can face serious fiscal pressure.
For countries like Nigeria, the lesson is even more important: debt should finance productive investments that create jobs, increase revenue and grow the economy not simply fund recurring expenses.
Debt can build a nation, but poorly managed debt can also become a burden for generations.
Debt is rarely used by governments to do anything productive.
Don't you think that if countries would go in debt and buy Hive with the debt money that would rise the price enough to pay debts back?
If I would take on a debt(I will not) I would take it for only a month and for only a few hundred eur. Just so I could buy Hive while it is cheap and return the debt as soon as possible. But even that seems like too high risk for me.
infinite energy! ;D
If governments keep borrowing and spending, we should be able to see some improvement in people's everyday lives. That's what I expect here towards the election in the next year.
Do we ever see real improvement though? I am hard-pressed for clear examples.
For some privileged people, yes.
With all the debt people still don't see much change. It really makes me wonder where all the money is going and who is really benefiting from it.
It is going into the pockets of those in power and those in supporte3d multinationals.
Wait, my life is supposed to be improved because we are trillions of dollars in debt? I totally missed that I guess!
Thanks