Splinterlands: Are we losing sight of what's important?

in Splinterlandslast year (edited)

I am by no means a whale or a community leader. I am however an observer with some skin in the game. Less than some but more than most. Beta, Kickstarter, Untamed, CL, TD, and I've bought into every single tangent this game has taken from there (Tract+, Runi x5, Out of pocket SPS, nodes x2, and thousands of packs). I own every single regular foil card (99% maxed out).
I watch every single town hall. I do consider myself a stakeholder, and do my utmost to support the team and this game. I am however, concerned.

Speaking of games. Is Splinterlands really a game? Well yes, but becoming less and less of one in my opinion. It is more and more dependent on what I describe as Crypto Alchemy to the detriment of the actual game. Is the game aspect one that people actually want to play? I will argue no in many cases. Most of the OGs don’t even play anymore, and many operate bots. In the best case they let human scholars play their decks. But those scholars aren’t playing because the game is fun and engaging. They are playing to make a living.

So much focus has been placed on tokens and game economy, the actual game play has lagged behind. The game can get tedious, especially with ranked play. I personally am not interested in playing it. I am interested in playing other games that provide little to no rewards because the game play is engaging. I don't need monetary rewards to play and enjoy a game. I have played games for years with no reward but the enjoyment of playing. Crypto games are new, but their nascence does not preclude them from needing to stay fresh, engaging, immersive, and relevant.

My engagement in the actual game is minimal, though I used to play a lot. I am thrilled that I am able to provide an income to someone, but they aren’t playing because the game is actually great. They would play a monetized version of Pong in order to pay their bills. The fact that bots and scholars are playing is sending misleading signals to us. At a 60-40 split and a full wild deck and a top tier player, I see about $300 per month in income for them, which is good money for someone in the Philippines. For me, the juice is not worth the squeeze, as the squeeze has become just plain boring. So what we are creating is a tiered game-- ‘investors’ that couldn’t bother playing hoping to have their bags pumped, and people in less affluent countries doing the actual playing, since there is no way they could ever afford a maxed-out deck. The team and many of the members in the Mavericks chat are hyper focused on token the value discussion. Remove the bots and the people seeking rent, and all you have left is a defi platform. This was never the original vision from what I remember? I thought the vision was to create a game that “I(Yaba) would want to play.”

The team and many the members in the Mavericks chat are hyper focused on the token value discussion. The discussion surrounding the success of Splinterlands typically involves:

  • Bull market for BTC
  • DEC/SPS flywheel
  • Liquidity / Exchanges
  • DEC sinks
  • Various ancillary tokens
  • Land (Depending on how much ‘game play’ is involved here versus more defi)

These continue to be huge distractions and are tangential to the game-- you know, the game where you choose cards and do battle with them?

We need to focus on making a game people (new ones especially) want to play instead of focusing on how to exploit the existing user base, internal economy, and waiting for BTC to pump. That other stuff would take care of itself if fresh players were flocking to the game.

Things like:

  • Marketing
  • New Player Experience / Onboarding
  • Improved Ranking System
  • More immersive experience
  • Player retention

In sum, the game is stale, and it’s not advancing enough to keep people’s interest. The game will drive the game economy-- this was the case before crypto (WoW gold anyone?). The true value is in the game in my opinion, tokens are ancillary and will derive their value from the game. Don’t get me wrong, I like the project and I love the team. I just think we have lost our way. We have become obsessed with the ‘crypto’ side of the equation and have lost the ‘create a game that we want to play’ side of it. Let us be realistic, this is rapidly becoming a defi project dressed up as a game. Over time, this is a recipe for decay of both users and investors. A great game is where the value lies. There are plenty of crypto games out there floundering because they decided to let tokenomics drive the game, and not the other way around. The game should stand on its own without crypto, and sadly it does not.

A personal anecdote: I have two 13-year old nephews I offered to let them play my full deck. They quickly lost interest--rewards be damned. Back to Roblox they went. If you can't get 13-year olds interested in your card-based battle game, you still have some work to do.

I know that these discussions are had ad nauseum in discord, but I wanted to collect mine in a more coherent manner. Your thoughtful replies are appreciated.

PS. Rewards for this post shared with my scholars.

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I guess maybe I am in the minority here, but I have found the recent additions fun and engaging. The extra battle condition makes for even more information to process and consider when planning for battle. Brawl rivalries and guild bragging rights are a bright spot in my week. Tournaments continue to offer timed play opportunities to battle against the best collections in the game.

I don't have an idea how to help with the new player experience, I was an easy sell. I enjoy pretty much all aspects of the game and while I've only been here for 15 months with mostly the same format, I still work to make time to play the battles myself everyday. There are definitely some shortcomings that need to be sorted before we reach the masses and I wasn't privy to the early days you talk about at the start of the article, but there's still an exciting game here for me.

I would say my biggest concern is the land. I know the focus is to create a resource generating environment to make use of obsolete cards, but I'm not sure how that contributes to more exciting gameplay for new players. To me, it just distracts from the main strategy of the battles into some resource management side hustle and only benefits the people already here without providing much of any utility to the new players.

Land aside, I'm not sure what else you are expecting from game play. I think the new abilities of the soulbound cards are sweet and working to level those up over time is making every daily focus exciting. I think a bigger tournament scene would be cool. Every time I've tried to come up with a fairly costed draft format I've failed, so that has proven to be a bit of a dead end for limited Splinterlands. Not sure what else there is until we start to see the added complexity of the spells and abilities generated from the land.

I'm happy, I'm collecting, I'm making some ROI, but it is about the game play to me and making the most of those 150 seconds!

I appreciate the input!

I would say my biggest concern is the land. I know the focus is to create a resource generating environment to make use of obsolete cards, but I'm not sure how that contributes to more exciting gameplay for new players. To me, it just distracts from the main strategy of the battles into some resource management side hustle and only benefits the people already here without providing much of any utility to the new players.

Land is more for the 'investor' side of the equation. A typical player who doesn't own land would need to purchase goods from a land holder in future to use spells or whatever. For you the change in game play would be having spells to use. For whatever that will be worth...

I'm glad you are enjoying it so far. I'm not trying to claim it's bad. I used to play a lot more, for me it became stale. How long have you been playing?

15 months now

Hit me up in another year! LOL

Will do! Excited to see what modern rotation and a new set bring to gameplay, in addition to further leveling my soulbound reward cards.

At the Mav chat I am more and more concerned about people trying to extract as much value as possible from the game. It is even hard to call it a game especially for them as they don’t play.

I am even more concerned when game makers themselves are more interested in discussing defi aspects, tokens and economy as opposed to try and make the game better. Recently there is this giant fuss about listing SPS to some second tier exchanges.

Where is the game I wonder.

I was just thinking about Mavs chat, it's the worst place to get signal regarding the actual game play. If I was only using that place to establish my priorities they would tend to skew away from the game in the direction it has been.

And that is exactly what is happening to the game. Aggy and Matt continue to get trend analysis from Mav Chat and that is not healthy for the game. It has just become a club for the “old farts” myself included!

You are right. This is what Luke has said in a YouTube video before that there's been too much focus on economy. Hopefully battles 2.0 comes and land comes faster. a draft mode would be nice too. Is your 13 yr old a fan of tcgs tho? I don't think we can compare Roblox to Splinterlands 😂. All kids love Roblox so it's kind of hard to beat that. My little sisters are obsessed with that game and I still don't get why 😂. What we need is magic the gathering, Yu-Gi-Oh and hearthstone players to get into splinterlands so hopefully team can make a more fun game for this to happen as you said the game aspect is lacking. People should also join Splinterlands because it's a fun game not just to make money or get rich fast as this model probably won't be sustainable. We need the people that play for fun and you are right we are missing that!

Great comments. I don't get Roblox either!

Is your 13 yr old a fan of tcgs tho?

one of them plays Hearthstone.

I've been playing GU for a while now, though I'm not sure why LVL 404 is considered a Novice?!

image.png

It has a fraction of the economic side, but I keep coming back for more.

Haha I'm lvl522 and also a novice. 😂 Ya GU is a different gameplay as the games can be longer.

Splinterlands is faster so there's both good and bad but ya like you said splinterlands hasn't been focusing too much on the game. Even the mobile app needs work and I'm not sure why they not willing to take the 30% hit on sales from apps. There's so many games that are good that take the 30% hit so I feel splinterlands is just losing out on a lot of potential revenue and player base by ignoring the mobile market. they can still incentive and give better purchase deals on their website if it's that important. Money is still money . Gu is gonna have mobile soon so I'm looking forward to that .

and your profile pic is your most rare card.
image.png

Good to know!

Novice only reflects on your collection afaik.

Great article. It was a very timely topic for me.
I only take my recent Splinterlands play seriously BRAWL, I've started using the bot as well.
According to my friends who play Axie, Axie doesn't have the phenomenon of bots dominating the top spots. They say the management is eliminating the bots.
But Splinterlands is positive about bots. I don't think that opinion in itself is a bad thing, but I think Splinterlands is far too positive about bots. I think this is one of the factors that make the game boring.
I could see my life moving in the right direction because of this game. And I made all kinds of friends. That is why I want this game to develop as a game and I want to help it as much as I can.

Thanks for your input. I've communicated with other top players like yourself who don't really participate in the DEFI part of the game and they share your concerns. I think most of us appreciate the success the game has had so far but we seem to be losing our soul lately.

Great post! People have been saying a lot these things for a while now but they always seem to fall on deaf ears. I'm glad to see more people starting to speak up about things like this.

The game will drive the game economy

I think this is one of the biggest points that people don't seem to understand. It's always BTC this or bull run that. If the game itself was engaging/fun and didn't have so many quality of life issues, the economy would would be in a much better place. All of this, "waiting on the next bull run" ideology is a terrible strategy. When was the last time you checked the price of BTC before buying packs or cards? My guess is never.

Too many times have I heard people saying, "I want to buy cards, but I just don't know anymore." I get their point and I've even said it myself. Why keep spending on something that's doing little to improve the actual game and instead focuses primarily on new sales and ways to artificially inflate token prices?

I really only stick around because tournaments are still somewhat profitable for me, but there's a lot of problems on that side of things too. We've heard about the battle pass idea but, it's already been said that until current resources are redirected at tournaments (unlikely) or there's another bull run (most likely), we're not going to get those much needed changes.

I do still think there's a lot of potential in the game, so hopefully things turn around soon. Unfortunately, the echo chamber is strong and I think there's too much of this:

The team and many the members in the Mavericks chat are hyper focused on the token value discussion.

and not enough of this:

We need to focus on making a game people (new ones especially) want to play instead of focusing on how to exploit the existing user base, internal economy, and waiting for BTC to pump.

!BEER

When was the last time you checked the price of BTC before buying packs or cards? My guess is never.

Bought the majority with Fiat TBH. I would never sell my BTC to buy game packs.

I do still think there's a lot of potential in the game, so hopefully things turn around soon.

Agreed, I wouldn't be around if I didn't hope for the same.

Thanks for dropping by!

A timely reminder. I have always been vocal about the nerfing of rewards and the lack of incentive for new players and the need to eliminate/limit bots. As a mid tier player, I have been around for long enough to remember when we this game 'blew up' and we were seeing 400+k a day on the secondary market and demand from new players drove the economy. Our player retention now is virtually non existent and we have lost many valuable investors to the economy as the bots trashed it and imo bad decisions surrounding rewards as opposed to hitting the elephant in the room on it's head.

To be honest, I am hoping land brings the changes we need. The game should drive the economy and we have seen selfish ambition manifest to protect assets of top heavy individuals time and time again at the expense of anyone who didn't invest pre 2021 and this imo has hurt the potential player base and game experience. I have always believed the best way to get a return for all investors is focus on the game and ensuring new players not only come but stay as they are the future investors of the game. To do this bots must be gone from the game and the gap in rewards must be improved and the game needs to be less expensive entry because at 4 or 5 bucks a pack on the primary market, you already wiped out 95% of your potential player base and made it an uphill battle for every future player who decides to stick around. The game just isn't worth that amount except for those who have already made bank. Make the packs $1 or 50 cents and suddenly you will see the playing field start leveling to protect new and future players and people will spend alot less time worrying about their investment.

But these are my thoughts prior to land and I am banking on land and interactive evolution of the game to get us back and on track into a fully immesive game. But it is worrying (and no surprise) to read your thoughts about what you have seen in Mav chat concerning tokenomics and that people in their are more focussed on improving their wealth than on improving gameplay experience. It makes me feel like any future investment I make will be devalued by future decisions in favour if those with a finacial monopoly above genuine player and game experience and that makes me not want to invest anymore.

Thanks for your comments. I'm not convinced that land will do anything significant for new players besides giving them spells to buy from landholders. How much will that actually enhance game play? Your guess is as good as mine. Land will not be the panacea that some make it out to be in my opinion, but time will tell. Land might be fun for me since I have 130+ plots, but most people can't afford one plot. As far as bots are concerned, I hate them too. I even hate the ones the high level players use though the cognitive dissonance is strong in that area ('good bots' vs. 'bad bots'). All game play automation is bad IMO. I agree on the packs being too expensive. I think that's one reason that CL sold as poorly as it did (though it's blamed on the bear market). The fact is that people seek out distractions in bear markets.

I've been saving for proposals for interactive land once we reach that point. I think land could be the platform that could mirror other well-proven timebased games with optional rts aspects. E.G Being able to send armies of cards e.g an earth splinter hoarde with summoner to battle for prized resources of another. Depending on how far away the plot or region is would determine how long you would be unable to use said cards and time limit the response of defenders (a day or 2) in a random battle against opponents 'defending' cards. Keep it ranked based so that silver players cant attack bronze etc but could attack diamond ranked accounts etc. But as you say we are in a world of the unknown but something like that could definitely spice up how people use land. Maybe even allowing non owners who stake in the land the chance to share raid rewards with cards stored in a plot. Thiese are just some pie in the sky ideas but there is a world of opportunity to improve the game immersion here on offer. Battling bosses on land, regional 'tavern' leagues, burning cards for valuable resources or items, God league (open or unlimited leveling arenas), Mythical Cards (above legendary) to be found via land interaction etc just to throw out a few ideas from the top of my head.

I would think there should be the option or a space in the interactive map to allow non owners the chance to navigate or traverse so that they too can be involved in other aspects of land and give those unable to afford a plot themselves at least the opportunity to do things in Praetoria.

My concerns:

  1. The team constantly "breaking" their promises. This TH you might hear something, whereas in the enxt TH you might hear the complete opposite.
  2. The team is focused an creating value based on hype/fomo/sales and not by improving certain aspects of the game/player retention/ mobile application
  3. The centralized approach, while preaching decentralization (it depends on the narrative - if it is in their interest than a centralized decision is ok, otherwise the decentralization card is being played)
  4. Too much RNG (battles, rewards)
  5. Most recent, the DAO writing a blank check for an exchange listing. (if the DAO is paying, shouldn't the DAO be the one signing an NDA?)

What I like:

  1. The recent SB cards, which changed the Meta - it made it fun again.
  2. Short battles (I do not have to play for hours to do my dailies)
  3. Brawls

An environment kinda "Tower of Ascension" style with some PvE with tiered ranks, some rewards, maybe some locked for only the tower, and weekly reset... That would be fun too

The centralized approach, while preaching decentralization (it depends on the narrative - if it is in their interest than a centralized decision is ok, otherwise the decentralization card is being played)

I've noticed this. It's like throwing a bit of red meat to the community and claiming decentralization, yet many controversial decisions aren't included.

Most recent, the DAO writing a blank check for an exchange listing. (if the DAO is paying, shouldn't the DAO be the one signing an NDA?)

Not really a DAO is it if it can't make informed decisions about what it's voting on?

I agree with your positives. I was skeptical about the SB cards but they seem to be working out.

I agree. The engagement and stickiness of the game itself is key to long term success. I am hoping that Land and Tower Defence provide some interesting new gameplay opportunities.

I still like to play from time to time. Mainly to try out new strategies or see if I can do better than my Archmage bot. If I am 100% focussed and not over-tired (rare with 5 kids) then I can do better.

But it is much harder to win than it used to be and personally I don't like losing. :-)

Thanks for your comments. I am excited for TD though that does nothing to enhance the core game. I'm ambivalent about land in many respects, particularly when it comes to your average player who doesn't own any.

Greetings @joshmansters a very good post.

Since 2018 I started playing "Splinterlands" by that time Steemmonsters, the game immediately charmed me, it reminded me of my old days playing YuGiOh, of which I am a big fan, I remember spending hours and hours playing splinterlands, and playing the manual tournaments, the truth, I still play because I still like the game, but, there is a truth that you said and that can not be denied, the game really since then has not seen big changes in the gameplay as such, so if I find many times tedious to play it, certainly everything nowadays revolves around the chips and although the economy is important, focus on the game and its evolution, is the real way to go to retain new players, if the game is fun and draws attention, eventually the economy will grow.

Particularly I would like a game more fun to play and easier to access, for example, something that keeps active are the guild fights, I like to compete in that sense and it encourages me to play, but, those battles I can only send them through the website of the game, but not through the mobile application, if I could send those battles through the mobile application would be great it is super easy to send battles through there and it is less cumbersome.

In short you have to improve the game, make it more fun and that players and / or investors are encouraged to play, the expansion of the land may be the way to that, in that I think, also, I have always liked the idea of including a story mode, where we have to fight with our cards for all praetoria somehow, maybe it seems crazy, but being a player of games of this type, the story mode encourages me to spend a whole game, and play it until the end.

I still enjoy it in a way, I love the idea of collecting cards, more than the other assets, the design and how great they look, I love them, I am very visual, but, these are things that I hope they can be fixed, I trust the team and it is an exceptional game, but, it can improve a lot in that aspect, this can be even more fun.

In short you have to improve the game, make it more fun and that players and / or investors are encouraged to play, the expansion of the land may be the way to that, in that I think, also, I have always liked the idea of including a story mode, where we have to fight with our cards for all praetoria somehow, maybe it seems crazy, but being a player of games of this type, the story mode encourages me to spend a whole game, and play it until the end.

I agree with you 100%. Story mode sounds like a great idea!

I still enjoy it in a way, I love the idea of collecting cards, more than the other assets, the design and how great they look, I love them, I am very visual, but, these are things that I hope they can be fixed, I trust the team and it is an exceptional game, but, it can improve a lot in that aspect, this can be even more fun.

Yup, that's why I collected every card practically. I don't distrust the team, but from time to time we all lose sight.

You nailed it in the head, that is the magic that has been lacking. The same magical fun factor that keeps the OG engaged and grows the game all the way to what we have today and somehow along the way we forgot what makes this game "Fun". I fully agree with the key points you brought up. Those should be the foundations we should focus on.

Appreciate the input!

Very thoughtful post and I really understand and support your point. First of all the game itself should be interesting and if it cant snatch a 13 year old’s attention, then clearly it needs some work. Hopefully with the new soul bound reward cards where we cant buy or rent them and instead we must play to collect them, I think it will encourage us more to play rather than be only interested in tokens and values. Great post!

Not to mention the garbage we decided to support in the name of "daily battle post" and the same damn thing we kept churning year after year and vote year after year. I am rather disgusted with that behavior especially from people who are there for a while. Time to ask the question what have YOU done for the game? The game has certainly done a lot for you.

Appreciate your comments!

It's the same story over and over again with all crypto based games. That is why I rather stick with my Nintendo switch and pay for the games I truly want to play. It's not about how much I can earn. Just how much I love the game and how hooked I get. Currently addicted to Potion Permit and waiting to get my hands on Octopath traveller 2. I want the same gaming experiences on crypto games. Who is going to change that?

Soulkeep - Tower defense should be fun. Early gameplay here


I sent you a pack :)

Thanks. I think of all the crypto-based games this one is the most special, though my day-to-day game is Gods Unchained. Both are good for very different reasons. I don't play console games anymore. I'm not good at moderation. At least with PC/Web3 games I can multitask--like right now I am working on my taxes.

I actually stopped playing altogether a few weeks ago because the game was becoming joyless. I found that playing the secondary markets was much more enjoyable and I figure that everything entailed from the Land economy/strategy part of the ecosystem is going to pique my interest as well.

Splinterlands is no longer just a card game, it's transforming into a strategy game and experimental environment where we are all able to build upon these assets. You can't automate the future diplomatic arrangements within the game that are to come.

Splinterlands rewards the brave, those who are engaged, and those who want to provide products and services to the community. The game has become secondary and if it was a game to be taken seriously (eSports), there wouldn't be a Battle API. The opportunity to create variants of the game is a massive opportunity to create a more eSports type of gaming environment. Someone that is not associated with Steem Monsters will have to build it, keep the bots out, and create that competitive atmosphere. The ability to re-invent these NFTs and the personas in different environments presents possibilities for game developers.

When it comes to marketing, they don't have a solid handle on who their target audience is.

I actually stopped playing altogether a few weeks ago because the game was becoming joyless. I found that playing the secondary markets was much more enjoyable and I figure that everything entailed from the Land economy/strategy part of the ecosystem is going to pique my interest as well.

I agree with this. The management of assets has become more interesting. This is only great for those that own enough assets worthy of managing, which is relatively small.

Splinterlands is no longer just a card game, it's transforming into a strategy game and experimental environment where we are all able to build upon these assets. You can't automate the future diplomatic arrangements within the game that are to come.

It's also multi-tiered. Unfortunately the lower tier has fallen behind and this is where new asset holders are born.

The game has become secondary and if it was a game to be taken seriously (eSports), there wouldn't be a Battle API. The opportunity to create variants of the game is a massive opportunity to create a more eSports type of gaming environment. Someone that is not associated with Steem Monsters will have to build it, keep the bots out, and create that competitive atmosphere. The ability to re-invent these NFTs and the personas in different environments presents possibilities for game developers.

Splinterforge is the tip of the spear with this offering boss fights to existing splinterlands decks.

When it comes to marketing, they don't have a solid handle on who their target audience is.

Agreed, a large percentage are holdovers from the Steem days who have been keeping the game afloat. I'd be curious to know the ratio of new asset holding users that didn't emerge from the steem/hive ecosystem.

Yes, the tiering is definitely evident and it's a bit complicated to explain.

In my case, I only had 61k Collection Power to start and I have been enhancing the collection through the secondary market as I have gone along (to me it is a bit like a challenge, if you follow my posts). I have enough of a collection that it can eventually be converted into something much more substantial, but those with a more casual and even a solely transactional relationship with Splinterlands (scholars) will miss out on the opportunities to create something that could be life-changing.

I agree with you, I have been playing the game for a long time, but all the extras are becoming more and more complicated. I cannot understand why we cannot have just one token to do everything. It is very difficult to start from the bottom, I was playing for my wife at a stage, she is at bronze league and it is extremely difficult to advance and to get cards as rewards, mostly some potions. I actually gave up to try and advance her game. I end up at diamond mostly, but a lot of time, I just get some SPS or potions as rewards in my chests, I would like monsters!!

They should definitely make it easier and more attractive for new players, otherwise the game will not grow.

I periodically try to play some bronze matches and I lose interest. It's hard to make a dent without buying key cards.

This was a nice piece, thank you. As a professional in the TCG industry (LGS since 1997) I can see some things that you are saying. I don't understand why my whole store is not playing this in their cells while they wait for the FNM round to be over. Definitely things to do. A year ago someone told me that Aggroed was planning some actions with LGS, but I guess the bear market put a brake on some plans.
Im optimist though. The crew is good and they execute well. Very few lags or dramas overall, definitely in the top 1% of everything P2E that is around . We'll see!
!Pizza
!Beer
#sps #bro #leo

Thanks for the comments. I am optimistic as well, but cautiously! :)

the game has problems from the ground up. because important aspects that captivate players are missing because of the economy. e.g. why you're forced to play all the elements. i've come to the conclusion that it's purely an economic thing, at the expense of the feel of the game. wouldn't it be much cooler if you could specialize in 1 element? when i was new, i immediately thought about what i was going to be, the death or fire guy. then i quickly realized that this wasn't going to work. because the game forces me to have all the elements. that kind of breaks the bond with my deck, instead of getting an old rare card from my element i have to upgrade other elements that i don't really like. all good games that focus on long term motivation have aspects like choose your class, choose your faction, or even make your own character. to make people feel more connected to their account....

I've said for a long time now, that I'd love to see Splinter-specific tournaments; for people who want to specialise in just one colour.

I could see that someone new to the game would want to specialize for both economic and educational reasons. GU for example doesn't care what GOD you used for the daily rewards, but to maximize in other areas you must play multiple ones. I hadn't thought about the style aspect though-- like Death is more my style so I'll play that exclusively.

Good perspective and observations with a vested interest!

(BTW I was looking at you profile and noticed I wasn't following you?!?! I could have sworn I was and corrected that immediately)

Thanks, I normally don't post with that account, but didn't notice I was logged in with it.

The problem is that if you don't get the economy right, the game dies. We don't talk about tokenomics because its fun.
Ultimately I think the key to enjoying the game more, is to be more social in the community.
Not just in discord, but on


Plenty of interesting new abilities of late, changing the meta and breaking some of those go-to lineups.

Appreciate the input. Can you provide any examples where this is the case or can point to a precedent for this view? Because from my view this is a common trope within the community, but I'm not sure it's based on reality.

Most non-crypto games, its much harder to sell assets for real value.
Many of those multi-player ones are ghost towns now. My 10 year old was recently lamenting he was too young for the glory days of Counterstrike, back before the player base moved on to other games.
Plenty of crypto games have gone belly up because the tokenomics weren't stable/viable.

which crypto game was so good that you can say the game is broken because of the economy? the truth looks more like that the games were junk and you have done the garbage only for money. and if the money is gone then yes then only garbage without money remains. if the games had been good, the people would have played it without chances of profit and from it would probably have come in the end again a value in the tokens. but a game that only relies on economics is like securities for an empty warehouse that is out of order. it never produces more value. so the value will not rise, unless you tell people that this empty warehouse is beautiful and then many people want shares of this warehouse for incomprehensible reasons, then the value rises briefly. but falls again because it was just a bubble that was filled.
because there will never be a customer who wants to store anything in this dirty warehouse

if the games had been good, the people would have played it without chances of profit and from it would probably have come in the end again a value in the tokens.

I play Gods Unchained every day. It's a crypto game but the rewards are very small--they didn't even have GODS rewards for the longest time, mostly cheap cards. The game is really good, the crypto aspect is a bonus.

Most non-crypto games, its much harder to sell assets for real value.
Many of those multi-player ones are ghost towns now. My 10 year old was recently lamenting he was too young for the glory days of Counterstrike, back before the player base moved on to other games.

Your transition from non-crypto games to crypto games is a bit of a non-sequitur. People left Counterstrike because the alternatives were better, and thus the market for items within the game tanked. Creating a better market for items people don't want accomplishes nothing.

Plenty of crypto games have gone belly up because the tokenomics weren't stable/viable.

I agree, now name me one that didn't have a shitty user experience and wasn't relying on tokenomics to drive demand for their game?

You're making my argument for me.

that doesn't make sense. there are thousands of games without an economy that still keep players hooked for years. look at world of warcraft, for example.

a lot of money is pumped into good games without the players expecting anything in return, except the item they have bought.

WoW is a very different beast. I've not played it, but they ban bots and they suspend players for buying gold.
Introducing the SPS governance token came with some extra complexities, like if WoW players won Blizzard shares in game-play.

WoW is a very different beast. I've not played it, but they ban bots and they suspend players for buying gold.

What does this have to do with anything besides WoW being so good that a black market emerged to sell in game items. That black market still exists by the way. It's further testament to how a game being good (and enduring) can drive a market for its goods.

the price for the spectral tiger is currently over 10 000 dollars. it becomes soulbound when used, people have no advantage in the game and can't earn anything with it and the in game economy is really fucked up!!!!! i think that's all you need to know to know that a good game makes more money than a game that only relies on economy.

now just imagine this spectral tiger would be an nft. the price would be even higher

and blizzard even sells gold itself. you buy a wow token from blizzard for fiat and exchange it in game at the auctionator for gold ;)
people spend masses of money there without the chance of profit ;)

I agree with your sentiment, though WoW does have an internal game economy and you've been able to buy and sell gold, items, and accounts for a very long time (still on ebay even) for fiat.

That said, these items don't have value because the game economy drives it. They have value because the game is fun and addictive and people are willing to pay for shortcuts to enhance their game play. The game in fact drives the economy.

I agree as well. I can play Anno 1800 for 12 hours straight. Splinterlands, just long enough to get my daily and ECR bouncing between 80 and 100%. That takes all of 20 minutes a day.
I also found it weird in a recent town hall. Aggy said something to the effect of "we need to make the game easy for new players". Then a few minutes later, Nate said something to the effect of "oh, I want to have a weapon that only a certain fraction of uber-dwarves can wield". Are they even talking to each other?

Thanks, There are definitely a lot of mixed signals involved here. I hope that new players are somewhat insulated from the complexity and can grow into over time.

Creating more card sets one after the other is just making it more bot-worthy and investment-heavy.

They need to be the least complex for user onboarding.

I don't mind more card sets if you have enough new players and your past sets are actually selling. Thanks for dropping by!

!1UP to appreciate the type of discussions we need in these though times.

Very good publication, so far I do not know much about Splinterlands, but with post like this I am understanding more about the subject, besides I learn with your experience to understand more about the subject.

I am glad you found it edifying!

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