I've been banging my head against the wall for the past few days, staring at a dazzling inconsistency between the rewards displayed in Steemit (next to the posts) and the actual rewards (displayed in user account -> Rewards tab).
This inconsistency potentially led to some strange values in steem.supply as well, so, until I figure out the math behind this, (if there is one), I think it's better to treat the values there with caution.
I'm writing this post primarily to learn how this is actually working.
What You See Is NOT What You Get, It's More
But how much more? Let's look at an example. This is what is displayed next to a post for which I already received the rewards:
So, the author share of this should be 75%.
$35 * 0.75 = $26.25.
But Steemit says I got $29.00. First inconsistency, checked.
Moving forward, let's see how much did I really get:
I have no idea from where these numbers popped out. But let's try to convert them all in STEEM / Steem Power and see if it checks out, somehow.
8 days ago, you would get 2.6 STEEM for 1 SBD.
So 14.499 x 2.6 = 37.8 STEEM.
Add to this the Steem Power: 37.8 + 2.4 = 40.2. Second inconsistency, checked.
And multiply this to the market price of STEEM 8 days ago, roughly $2.89:
40.2 x 2.89 = $216.17. Although the post says I got $29. Third inconsistency, checked.
A Potential Solution
If I divide the actual rewards in USD to the rewards displayed in USD in Steemit, I get something that may start to make sense:
216.17 / 29 = 7.44.
$7.44 is close to the price of SBD at the moment of posting.
That may suggest that what you see in Steemit is the value in SBD (a claim which is supported by the value returned by the API calls, which is something like "32.47 SBD"). In this case, the fact that Steemit presents those rewards as being in USD is quite misleading. It may be a legacy thing, from when 1 SBD was 1$, but this is not the case anymore.
Also, this doesn't solve much about the first inconsistency, the one about the author / curators split.
I'm still trying to find some predictability in this, taking into account price feeds and market feeds, but at the moment all I can do is to accept that I didn't find any acceptable one yet, and to issue a warning about how potential rewards are displayed in steem.supply.
You may get more than what it says in Steemit, less that what it says in steem.supply, or a different value.
The only one that is guaranteed to be accurate, is the one you actually get in your wallet, after 7 days.
I will post an update once I get the hang of it.
I'm a serial entrepreneur, blogger and ultrarunner. You can find me mainly on my blog at Dragos Roua where I write about productivity, business, relationships and running. Here on Steemit you may stay updated by following me @dragosroua.
https://steemit.com/~witnesses
If you're new to Steemit, you may find these articles relevant (that's also part of my witness activity to support new members of the platform):
That is really very confusing.
Let's go over it.
The choice to use $ instead of a proprietary mark is very confusing, but this is not USD, but "Steem bucks". No, not Steem Backed Dollars, just "Steem bucks." Just don't think of it as dollars. Actually, the only currency Steemit uses is VESTS, and everything else is translated, including Steem, which is confusing.
You got more than 75% due to people voting before 30 minutes (and self-voting).
Your reward was 29 Steem bucks. You get half of that in SBD, which is 14.5 SBD, which is about what you got. The 29 is rounded very slightly up in your case, explaining the 14.499.
The other half you get is given in Steem Power. You get it in the value of $15 USD divided by the USD price of 1 Steem over the 3.5 days before you get the pay-out, according to the Price Feed.
The Price Feed value of Steem when you received the rewards has been $5.863 USD, and thus, 14.5/5.863 = 2.473.
The value of what you received is simpler to calculate:
50% of your Steem bucks is the actual worth of your SP, plus [Steem bucks displayed number x 0.5] times the SBD current value.
Or in your case 14.5 (SP) + 14.499 x 7.44 (SBD) = $122.37 USD.
If you put it like this, it checks out. I'll run out a few more calculations and if it checks, I'll update steem.supply as well, with the current algorithm it seems quite off.
Thank you!
Thank you both. Steem.supply is the best tool I have to promote steemit to new users. Srsly. Also, newbies in the first week who have yet to see a payout? NEED steem.supply
So thank you. <3
This would be nice. I've always considered steem supply extremely inaccurate, as I have gotten way less SBD than it predicts in the past.
I arrived to this conclusion as well when I did the math. It seems the 30 minutes rule and the self voting was not factored in when OP posted his computation which is why his computations were off.
i agree with your described @geekorner.
If we have reward in lower Steem price, more SP we got and so as the otherwise
I was looking at that math too and couldn't figure it out. I have excel sheet with so many different ideas and formulas.
Thanks :D
I'm glad one of us seems to know whats going on. It's all way over my head ;-)
I wish I could. I'm just looking at different scenarios, not knowing which one is "real". It's like looking at a 3D movie without 3D glasses: you kinda get what's going on, but it's all so blurry that your eyes start to hurt.
Yeah I know what you mean ;-)
Do you know if the rewards are calculated when the vote is made or after the 7 days. eg my vote was worth less 7 days ago so do the people get the amount when I cast or the amount its worth on "maturity?"
Its all very complicated for something that on the surface SEEMS so easy
AFAIK it's calculated in vests at the moment of voting.
Your vote's worth is decided in VESTS when you vote. Your vote is then always worth that amount of VESTS.
The pay-out depends on how much said VESTS are worth when 7 days pass. So if Steem's value rises in the 7 days since you vote, your vote ends up worth more money.
Thanks for the explanation both of you. I have be wondering this for a while.
This inconsistency in rewards split doesn't speaks well of steemit and it is confusing, Does this means we are been deceived or an error in calculation?
Most likely an error - or an inconsistency in the way numbers are presented.
I'll take a note of the SBD price at the moment of posting and try to figure out of if the actual reward is aprox the price displayed x the price of SBD.
I was wondering.
thanx for the explanation.
you are right @dragosroua about this payouts reward inconsistency, even a month ago i asked this questions to many senior steemians but i am not satisfied from their explanations. i am also shocked when first time i saw these calculations very depressing. I just want to met a mathematician who satisfied me on these calculations or tell me the formulae or any scenerio they adopt.
Thanks dragos for point out serious issue.
Could the discrepancy in the author reward being greater than 75% of total be due to people who would have gotten a large(ish) curation reward having voted early (within the first 30 minutes of the post), thereby giving up a portion of their reward to the author? I've read somewhere that this is part of the calculation.
Example, if you vote at the time when post time = 0s, 100% of the curation reward goes to the author. at time t = 30min 100% of curator reward stays with curator.
I know about the reverse auction going on in the first 30 minutes. May be, I will have to run some calculations, thanks for the suggestion.
I also know there is a proposal to move the part allocated to the author back to the reward pool (while still "penalizing" the early voters) but I don't know if it has been implemented yet.
It hasn't, it's going to be in HF20.
Thanks.
Really really complicated to understand no matter how many times I tried to follow lol. I somewhat understand though I guess. I always treat Steem Supply as an estimate though, its still an amazing tool to see the rough amount of SBD you can expect on what days.
If you upvote your own post, you, as the author, get a larger part of the curation reward because of the 30-minute rule. The author/curation reward ratio is therefore not 75%/25%, but 82.5%/17.5% in your example.
You earned $29 on your post. 50% in SBD which is 14.5 SBD, the other 50% in Steem.
You get that curation added to the author payout? It's not separately, in the curation reward section?
Yes, it's added to the author payout.
Edit: If you upvote your own post at the moment you post it, it is added to the author reward. If you upvote your own post after 30 minutes you get your full curation reward separately.
HF20 is going to change this.
Thankd
Yep, I have seen that there are some inconsistences between what is shown and what I get, but I started to get used to it and tell myself that this post is going to give me a few dollars and that one is going to be around a few cents. It is easy to be a minnow, you know? :))
This is the same problem that I want to figure out. Thank you for bringing it up.
@dragosroua: Here is my little grain of sand, correct me if I am wrong.
Loosk to me that posts and comments are paid in pure units of value, different than SBD or Steem
In a post, everyone talks about the split 75% -25%, but the 75% split is into SBD which need to be multiplied by SBD Market Value in real time in order to get the real USD $ FIAT Conversion.
When I see the $ at the level of posts I think of it as Pure Units of Value and not USD. A lot of people is wasting money because of this confusion.
I don´t worry so much about the discrepancy since it is really an indicator. I worry about your site constantly sending HTTP ERROR 500. This Page is not working.
Looks to me you have an under powered server
Yes, looks like the content nodes I'm using are upgrading at the moment...
Great post. I also confused about this. Thanks for sharing such a good post
Thanks for this detailed post. Most helpful for minnows like me
It is very complicated thanks but still i did not get this...pleasecan you tell me which is more benefiting full power or 50/50
When SBD is worth over $1 USD, it's better to go for 50/50.
SBD right now is worth about $8.
The only one that is guaranteed to be accurate, is the one you actually get in your wallet, after 7 days.
I was just trying to explain this to someone earlier tonight. It's confusing as hell but that statement can be pretty much guaranteed.
So much maths involved :D
And why not put the size of the award at once in cвd? Then we would understand how much we really get in a week!
I had that confusion the value that steemit reflects as a reward is not invested in $ if not in SBD, and making the calculations you comment is easy to confirm.
Yes, because while the payment is not made, the price of the SBD and the steem fluctuate, and for that reason we see that the payment of our publication varies constantly
Thanks, I'll be waiting for more updates
Thank God I'm not the only one confused
Yeah...... I like what it says but way off what it will be......
Over 80 steem from a post showing $23ish, that would be great but not plausible....
Still updating it, try in a few hours.
sbd price has created lots of up and downs
It's my fourth week in Steemit and I have had the same confusion since I claimed my first reward. I tried to understand but I just dig deeper holes then confuse myself even more. Please post more updates about it when you can.