The Stretching Rewards Pool

in LeoFinance2 years ago (edited)

This morning, the Feed price (that informs the vote values and rewards) hit 2.00 for the first time ever on the Hive blockchain. That is quite a milestone, congrats! This feed price works on a 3.5 day moving average, which just means that it doesn't correlate to the immediate price of HIVE, it balances it out so there aren't large movements up and down and the increase trails behind to produce an average.

I don't know all of the math, but what you will notice on posts for example, is that even though no one new might be voting on them, their value will increase. However, it is good to note that the HIVE distributed remains the same, but the HBD will be increasing also. As well as this, vote values themselves will increase, but the HIVE a vote distributes will remain the same, as it all depends on the vested stake in relation to all other voters.

So to put it simply, a $1 vote might now be a $2 dollar vote, but in HIVE value, they are identical. But, because they distribute some HBD as reward, the HBD will double.

If HIVE feed is $1 and vote is $1

100% vote will distribute:
1 HIVE = 0.25 HBD + 0.25 HIVE for the author. 0.5 HIVE POWER for the curator.

Note: With the same account voting at a higher feed price.

If HIVE feed is $2 vote is now $2

100% vote will distribute:
1 HIVE = 0.5 HBD + 0.25 HIVE for the author. 0.5 HIVE POWER for the curator.

See how it works?

If price goes down significantly, the inverse happens. vote value goes down, the value already on posts go down, HBD foes down - the HIVE distributed remains the same.

image.png

Okay, having said that as a refresher, let's delve into something a bit different.

Because values are increasing, you might have noticed a few things over the last week or so. There are a lot of "returnees" coming back to Hive, people I call "fair-weather" participants. When times are good they come back and post to earn, when times suck, they are ghosts. That is okay - everyone does their thing, but if you are an investor in the platform, your vote is your voice that you can use to influence the success of Hive. Personally, I don't want to support people who are only looking to cash out.

But, there are other things to consider now too.

Hive is no longer a blogging platform exclusively, but the blog side of the ecosystem is visible. This blockchain which is worth close to a billion dollars in current market cap (It was around 1.5B at the high), houses other activity too, the most popular currently being Splinterlands, which is probably nearing another billion when all the different assets and things are pooled together. Plus, other communities, games, projects etc. This means that while very visible, the blog side isn't nearly as important as it once was. But, it is incredibly important because it is the face of the Hive ecosystem and a place where all of the Hive experiences gather to talk about their communities. It is a very eclectic place.

But, with the increase in price and of course people filtering through Splinterlands into the blogging side, there are going to be a lot of noobs who don't necessarily understand all of the blogging-side history. They don't know what a good post is or a shitpost, they don't know about how plagiarism and spam is generally punished and serial offenders are often blacklisted, they don't know what your rules are for your community. All they know is that they have found a place that either supports the community they entered from or, they have heard they can earn well by posting.

The more price increases, the more there are going to be people looking to earn and extract and this is actually a good thing for the blogging side. It might not seem it, but do you remember those numbers from up the top? What this means is that with less HIVE we are able to spread more value to users. For most of the extractors and shitposters, they aren't actually going to be able to get much Hive, as people aren't going to put much value on their posts. That means that considering there is about 150M Hive liquid currently, there isn't really going to be that much more heading to the exchanges.

An easier way to visualize this is:

image.png

That is the current rewards fund and its value at the $2 feed price. At the start of the year, that was about the same amount of HIVE, but the fund was worth less than 100K in total, because HIVE was sitting at around 11 cents. To visualize the difference, at the start of the year, based on a single snapshot of the rewards pool, about 1000 people could get a $100 dollar post (not including interest, witnesses etc for ease of calculation). But now, with the same amount of HIVE 15,000 people could have a $100 dollar post.

There are nowhere near 15,000 posts currently that are worth $100 dollars.

This is why you are going to see much higher post rewards on some and lower on others. The thing is, quality really does matter on average. So does relationships, track record, behavior, topic, personality, disposition, engagement and a raft of other community, cultural and personal aspects that people use to evaluate a post's value. Do you have the skills and qualities to attract voter attention?

But, it is good to remember now that, the same amount of Hive is being distributed between a 10 dollar post when the feed price was $1 and a 20 dollar post when the feed price is now $2. This means that "value and overvalued" change meaning, and have to be considered in relation to other content on the platform.

Why I am writing this is a reminder for the people who have been here for a while as we may have forgotten some of the mechanics of this and for the new people coming in who do not understand why their posts are getting pennies, while some other posts are getting large amounts. For the more experienced people, use your vote wisely and support what and who you think adds value to your investment and experience. For the new people, engage and build a presence here, this isn't a "get rich quick" scheme. Most of the people who you see are consistently getting rewarded well have been grinding for years. Crypto isn't going away - HIVE is a massive opportunity to not only earn, but be a part of a global economic revolution that can empower you and fundamentally change your future.

Don't squander the opportunity.

Many have. So many over the years have wasted their potential here, mostly because they looked short, sold early, and treated the community poorly. This is not an ATM, and while it is a place that protects your right to say and act however you choose, it is not a place that is going to reward you no matter what you say or do.

Freedom of speech doesn't come with the right to earn on what is said. Remember this.

Having said that, for the old timers, be somewhat lenient if you think you are dealing with a noob and perhaps guide them a little toward a better course, or reward them a little for when they are delivering what you would like to see more of. It might not be perfect, it might not be polished, but a little incentive and a helpful word can go a long way to turning a noob into a valuable community member. Four years from now, those people are going to be valuable - if they make it through the bear.

Can't wait for $20 dollar HIVE.
Just think what is possible then....

Taraz
[ Gen1: Hive ]

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I'm excited for the kind of developer talent this attracts. If you're contemplating building a new game on a chain somewhere, Hive is absolutely the gold standard.

It would be incredible if a mainstream gaming company took interest... I wonder what Blizzard could put together for a blockchain based game?

I don't know how to get developers in for this kind of support - I know developers, but I don't think I could get them funding. Though, I know one who might just dev some stuff for the fun of it :)

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I feel like I should really understand this by now. I probably do understand this by now because it seems that I understand/know things that I need to most of the time, but I don't feel like I do XD

Making it through bear markets/periods is pretty stressful.

Encountering actual bears is probably also pretty stressful, but I still think they're cute XD

What happens if the price triples or quadruples from here?

Are there 60K posts worth $100 each?

Fun things to consider.

Great message and reminder. We need to take the lead and ensure what we are posting is up to par to be the "face of Hive". Blogging is not the only thing here but it does still get a lot of attention.

We all can spend a bit more time fine tuning our posts to increase the "quality" of them.

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Are there 60K posts worth $100 each?
Fun things to consider.

It is going to be quite amazing, especially considering that the HDF development that could take place in conjunction with a growing community.

The key will be seeing the numbers grow. When there are 100K people on Hive posting each day, it gets amazing to consider what the reward pool will look like in terms of distribution.

A lot of the answers for Hive simply comes in a much larger increase in activity.

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Absolutely. Price goes a long way as an attractor, but it is usecase that will keep them here. There has to be more value than the individual post reward and I think that is developing now. For me, it is a no brainer as I love to write, but for others, they need various forms of entertainment too. This is part of why Splinterlands has been so successful, as it is an easy in that stacks and compounds several hooks.

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60k posts each day that are worth $100? I really don't think so 😂 If it comes down to it, extra posts could be made with communities and initiatives as beneficiaries?

!ALIVE

I made my Black Friday Buy, and am now at 9,000 HP Plus. A big milestone for me 4 and a half years of voting, commenting and sometimes posting. The results:

one dollar plus.png

A $1.20 plus vote, (for today anyways). I remember back in Feb 2018, I was so happy my account value went to $2,00 SP, and I had a full two cent vote, that for just a short time went to ten cents and the biggest vote I ever had back then was a one day $0.16 cent vote. Happy times back then.

Of course the big vote, (big for me) did not last long, maybe a week, but it was just extra fun when I had that. Steem/Hive except for the transitional time, has been pretty fun for me. I know my vote value will fluctuate, but it really does feel good to be able to give my followers, and those I follow a much better reward than in the past.

Some will be added in to my slowly growing list of Hive friends, and other list that I have. Connections is what has made Hive so much fun and rewarding for me.

This is where I'm at now - if I was at full power I would have my first ten cent upvote 🙌🙌🙌 It really does feel great ❤️

It takes time to build, and having the hard Fork to Hive helped me really get off the ground. but by simply powering almost everything up, It is fun when you hit that milestone of a ten cent vote. I loved all the vote value rises. two cents, big big happy time there no more dust level vote. then five cents, and ten cents then a two cent vote at 50% vote power I could vote on twice as many people with a non dust vote.

Keep the powering up going and the vote value grows and the return value also.

That's exactly what I've been doing, and so far it's been working really well :) I'm loving Hive!

!ALIVE

It feels good, doesn't it? What is going to be interesting is when all the other mechanisms kick in, as 50M people are here. 10K HP will be more than 99.9% of people and wield some power.

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I find it hard to believe I am at rank 1177 of Hive holders, and need to hold less than 12,000 to be in the top 1000 HP holders of Hive. New Whale in the making? Not sure yet, but it sure is fun being able to have value when voting. Now I just need to be careful of voting and not get to a point I need to auto vote stuff, even though I sort of do, just not enough time to look at everything.

I’m a wet-around-the-ears New Bee and your post is so very encouraging. Great read!

Can't wait for $20 dollar HIVE.
Just think what is possible then....
Me too🥂😄🥂🙏🏽

Wet around the ears sounds a bit like a kink ;D

Welcome :)

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I cannot say about all but there are some posts which are worth 100 dollars bt getting too less. But again it's all come down to so many factors. If ever Hive touches $20, I will be financially free.

It is never a perfect correlation, but generally consistency catches up. What is interesting is (because of the pump) I might get my first ever 300+ post. I didn't even get one at the Steem ATH. Surprisingly for some, I am not actually among the highest per post earners, but I am probably the most consistent poster with something relatively useful to say :)

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I am probably the most consistent poster

I can confirm that :)

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Consistency helps, but isn't a guarantee. Some of my posts are still giant flops voting wise 🤣

Is it so that if Hive value goes up, curation reward will increase as Hive value is increased. Am I right?

yes. Curation value increases, but the Hive will remain the same (all things remaining equal).

If you earn 1 HIVE in curation that is worth 1 dollar, you will earn one Hive in curation when it is worth 2 dollars. The difference is, Hive is worth more .

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Ah ok. Thanks.

Pretty cool writeup.. This is really an encouraging post to noobs, oldies and the rest.

I wrote in my post that I except to see at least 50,000 active rivers in every country if we keep on growing at this rate.

I am saying this because some people will eventually return to hive.

If other things are going to be built on hive then we will be seeing hive in the top 100 coins.

A question for you

What is needed to get a voters vote?

I am hoping that this bull run and subsequent bear will be interest build and then, users collect to red it out for the next bull. It is the best place for crypto people to be.

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Hard work is the scare for so many and it shouldn't be as it is always rewarded. Like you said, Hive is not an ATM and yes, we have seen my of the "returnees" disappear when the bear run started in the past.
Let's hope that this time round many will stick around as $20 can turn out out to be a great magnet.
In the meantime we just continue to do what we have done over the past years.

There are those who will never stick around, some who will never leave :)

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It's hard to leave once you get addicted :) ....

Oh yes, a great truth and such is life.

Good analysis and update for hivers.

THanks.

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I was wondering what the mechanics of what will happen as the changes come. Going to be pretty great to sock away a hell of a lot more HBD for well rewarded posts I can tell you that! I am glad that I took the opportunity to power up a lot of hive as I was getting it during cheaper price times, most notably the 2k I powered up in October. Couldn’t imagine being able to power up 2k now lol that would be wild!

Good info and reminder on the fluctuations of votes and stuff. I saw some pretty wild numbers but I think that’s good.

Lastly, I got hive on someone’s radar that actually was one of the people who got me into it all in the beginning. He had no idea hive was a fork of Steem so I was helping educate him on the place. He’s going to try Leo since one of his primary interests is crypto now, so hopefully I can get him to stick around. This was all before the madness price increases!

Going to be pretty great to sock away a hell of a lot more HBD for well rewarded posts I can tell you that!

For sure :) This changes the will to save too. 10% - maybe 20% soon? pretty attractive.

Couldn’t imagine being able to power up 2k now lol that would be wild!

It is crazy stuff. I bought back HIVE at 2.60!!!

He’s going to try Leo since one of his primary interests is crypto now, so hopefully I can get him to stick around.

I think this makes sense, doesn't it? Crypto people should be here by default.

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I really appreciate the effort of everyone on the blockchain trying their possible best to see that this blockchain grow more than what it is before and it is really a good improvement seeing the price pump up to that high amount on the blockchain, it is really awesome and better step for progress in the blockchain

Just makes sure you are putting in the effort too and helping others. It is easy - add value.

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Great Post, explaining it for newcomers well

Thanks mate. You well?

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yep doing just fine. Thanks :)

Hi Taraz

I was actually pondering this this morning when I noticed that voting amounts had gone up substantially over the last 2 days, it makes more sense to me now, so thanks for the insight into the mechanics.

I am sure that at some stage in the past there were people who have been here from the start talking about "one day when Hive hits $3" and that's just happened, so $20 might look like a pipe dream to to some now, but it's totally plausible in the grander scheme of things.

There are so many different dynamics, it is hard to keep track, especially over different chains and after forks. It is worth getting a broad enough understanding to set some loose heuristics for visualization though.

20 dollar Hive and this place is incredibly different. The Hive development Fund would be worth several billion :)

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I always learn new stuff when I read articles like that one you posted, but a LOT of it goes over my head too.

Gosh yes, I hadn't even thought of that, but hey, nothing's impossible.

That $2 looks pretty sweet doesn't it!!? We knew this icrease would come. It's just a matter of time!! Go All Things Hive!!! :)

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10x from here?

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We could use some new tutorials for those beginners. Everyone has to start somewhere. I hope they get committed to the platform and behave well, but it is kind of our job, as long-term users, to "teach them" how it all works.

There are plenty of tutorials out there, but I am sure more people will write them, as they are "easy" reposts for some. I don't write tutorials though, I just want people to have a broad enough understanding that they can participate well enough to carry themselves.

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I have written a fair share of tutorials myself too, but this blockchain has evolved a lot and I haven’t followed properly so I don’t feel confident to do so myself anymore (for now)

The idea is out there though

Great analysis. As usual. Object lesson for noobs and a gold reminder for the "older" blockchain inhabitants. Also a bit of a vindication for the bloggers...

Thank you :)

He’s going to try Leo since one of his primary interests is crypto now, so hopefully I can get him to stick around.

Blogging isn't going anywhere fast. In fact, it is likely going to increase in popularity because almost anyone can get involved.

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Blogging isn't going anywhere fast. In fact, it is likely going to increase in popularity because almost anyone can get involved.

Exactly. Especially since vlogging has become a thing. IMO, it's a lazy way in (or out), but then, like you, I write...

This has gone a long way boss and thanks for the updates aß well

no worries

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Thank you for this informative analysis. And the reminder this is a long term adventure. And for the encouraging rewards...🤗

Hope you take away something useful enough that you can apply it to develop your processes.

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Yeah. Surely.

I am seeing some crazy rewards on trending:)

Don’t know what to do!

:)

It will normalize in time. This is just the pump effect. Over the space of weeks and months (saying it stays here), the votes will disperse wider.

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Yeah... I'm actually debating on whether or not to continue with full upvotes or spread the love a little more. What an awesome "problem" to have 🙌

Couldn't have said it better, @tarazkp!

THanks!

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Great explanation and I got a big chunk for a post today, got that HBD in the Savings for building a stablecoin portfolio as well. Hive Power is sweet as well, but in these times I simply wished I had it liquid to take action.

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I am looking to do a bit of HBD saving, but I am also thinking about using some to fund my Splinterlands buys.

Too much liquid and, too much gone. What I do "recommend" (you know what you are doing) is always having a small percentage liquid to play for some fun :)

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I like the way you think, it's up to us to help the newbies, it can only benefit the entire community in the long run. I just celebrated 3 years on hive and I will continue to enjoy this space. I am still learning from others here and I will never forget how generous people were with their tips and advice.

$20 dollar hive, man wouldn't that be something?

There is always so much to learn here. I am trying to keep up with a fraction of it, and it is hard work :)

So many ways to add value though, so there is no excuse for anyone not to be able to build a home here.

Oh yes for sure. I am thrilled about the money made, but #hive is way more than that.
Some of the people I have met have touched my life.

Keep putting out your knowledge, this gal is interested.

Great way to keep everyone in the limelight.
$20/Hive will make this place like a magnet.
A lot of work ahead of us.

!BEER

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yeah, it would definitely attract people, as well as media attention. thousands of people earning tens of thousands a year from blockchain activity, not just investing and selling.

In the old chain, does someone knows who holds the record for the post with the most rewards?

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Umm.. not sure, but there was at least a post to raise mone for someone with cancer (darthnava) that was around 40,000. There was also one before my time in 2016, a makeup tutorial that was around 35000.

Thank you for this. It certainly makes me strive to have better and quality posts and to spend time learning more about the other features of the Hive ecosystem.

Good luck out there :)

Thank you :) I am now onto exploring Leo Finance :)

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Thanks for the detailed explanation of the reward pool mechanisem, @tarazkp. Reblogged.

You are welcome :)

Having said that, for the old timers, be somewhat lenient if you think you are dealing with a noob and perhaps guide them a little toward a better course, or reward them a little for when they are delivering what you would like to see more of. It might not be perfect, it might not be polished, but a little incentive and a helpful word can go a long way to turning a noob into a valuable community member. Four years from now, those people are going to be valuable - if they make it through the bear.

Amen.

I was one of those noobs in 2017

@marki99 thanks. I followed you


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Hey @tarazkp, here is a little bit of BEER from @pouchon for you. Enjoy it!

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Wow, this was a very enlightening post for me explaining vote values. I have seen my rewards go up (a lot) several times in the past days, and thought this had to do with the higher price of $HIVE. I had no idea how the mechanics actually worked. You explained it very well, thank you for that!

I've been creating a lot of content in the past week after being absent for a few weeks due to personal circumstances. It has been an absolute joy to see higher votes as I'm aiming at growing my stake for the speak network snapshot :)

I've also enjoyed it a lot seeing my vote has an actual (small) value now. I love all the things going on in the Hive communities, and I truly wonder how many people will have found Hive in the next 6/12 months.

Again, thanks for the detailed explanation!

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What you said about hardly any extra Hive heading to the exchange... I love that idea!

New people are definitely worth guiding. If they are genuinely interested, and can be taught how to put a good post together, we could very well be helping the next influential leader of tomorrow get off to a good start.

It is quite confusing as have noticed my vote value went up considerably. Just takes getting used to and understanding how this happens. All good though and not complaining but agree there is going to be many old users returning trying to work this place out. Many new ones which I have no issue helping along the way.

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