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RE: Downvote early, downvote often

in #ethics4 years ago (edited)

If platforms (including Steemit) in unpalatable due to (dick moves by those in power or outright censorship) why aren't moves being made by those affected to create their own platforms where they can decide the rules.

I have neither the time or the money or the expertise to "start my own blockchain".

I believe an elegant solution would be perhaps for someone to clone steemit and reverse the rankings (this would be the ONLY modification). It could be steem.freespeech or upside-down.steem or some other generally self-explanatory title (@ura-soul and @themarkymark, could you please give me a quick opinion on how feasible you think this idea (a reverse rep view of steemit) would be to implement?).

That way, the most downvoted posts would show at the top of the trending page.

And everything with a payout or pending payout above 20 steem would be automatically hidden (with a reveal button for the curious).

It might look a mess, but I'd definitely check it out.

To delegate, right-click and open this link in a "new incognito window" (so forms and cookies don't get cached) https://steemworld.org/@practicalthought - then click "delegation" on the left, then delegate or undelegate or modify existing delegations as you see fit at any time. It doesn't require your master password, just your "active key", so any "risk" is extremely low. I believe delegating is much better than upvoting because you don't have to do it every day (it's like a semi-permanent upvote to the account instead of to a single post) and you never lose the steem-power, you can take it back whenever you want.

So it's kinda like a "super-pat.reon" because you don't have to give anybody your credit card info and you can take the money back if you find a better priority and nobody can stop you (pat.reon could potentially ban certain users in the future).

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It could be steem.freespeech or upside-down.steem or some other generally self-explanatory title (@steemchiller, could you please give me a quick opinion on how feasible you think this idea (a reverse rep view of steemit) would be to implement?).

I don't think that it would be worth the effort. Many (I guess most) shit accounts have a low rep, so one would need to filter manually and go through all the mess just to find a few interesting posts.

Since the majority of people actually don't want to see most of the downvoted stuff, there is not much money to be made with such a system. It's not a super bad idea, but I think it should be solved within the regular platform by providing more filtering features.

Sustainable platforms can be found where the mainstream hangs around. With currently only ~ 1.4 million users on chain it's probably just a waste of time. Many good projects died, not because they were bad, but because the targeted audience was just too small at that point in time.

Would it be relatively easy to just make a page that showed the top downvoted posts? And maybe the top downvoted users? I'd like a page that perhaps showed downvoted posts that my voting power could be used to counter-vote. Maybe something like this is already available and I just don't know about it?

The regular APIs are designed to return the data ordered descending. For a performant solution one would need to implement own API calls on blockchain/hivemind level and provide own nodes which run the new logic or build an own database that is optimized for the new queries.

It's not just about forking condenser and changing a few variables. Most changes would have to be made on the backend.

Ah, so, maybe not as easy as, https://usesteem.com/steemwhales/ (which appears to be down at the moment).

I have neither the time or the money or the expertise to "start my own blockchain".

As many also don't. However, I notice that some of those being touted with large followings elsewhere never seem to consider such an idea. I laugh when I see some pushing to bring them here as they would find themselves subject to the same treatment you are posting about here.

As mentioned before, I don't delegate as it would require me to give an active key to a third party. I sent the 1 Steem as I said, which will benefit them more if they power up as they will always have it without fear of being undelegated.

The reason I mention someone(s) who feel the stake system is unfair start their own token system either using SMT or the Steem engine is exactly what Markymark explained. It is hard coded into the chain itself. The only way one could utilize the blockchain and neutralize current large stakeholders would be creating their own tokens. They would benefit from all the pluses of the chain itself (speed and cost) while not being held to the same punitive (nor rewarding) possibilities. This would probably be more feasible in the long run than bringing many who are actually being deplatformed here, as I pointed out they would also probably incur some of the downvotes from those being mentioned for disagreement over their messages.

I sent the 1 Steem as I said, which will benefit them more if they power up as they will always have it without fear of being undelegated.

Thank you for your support.

Rep is part of the blockchain, not the front end. You could make a front-end (even clone Steemit condenser) that just doesn't display rep or uses some other method to calculate rep (although you would need a place to store this data).

Thank you for your reply.

So, ball-park, programming + url registration/hosting + data storage... a few thousand dollars?

Depends if you are building a new rep system, or just removing it from the UI. Removing rep would be easiest, building a new one much more complex.

Perfecto. About how much do you think it would be to just remove rep? And do you think people would want to DDOS the site if it started gaining popularity (can that be mitigated)?

Hard to say, it varies greatly not on the work but the person doing it.

Removing REP from the UI is one thing, but you also have to deal with the hiding comment behavior as well.

You can use CloudFlare to mitigate most low level DDOS attacks, but high level ones would require a lot of cash (DDOS protection is very expensive).

I think you would need to do a lot more than hide rep to get a front end that would be popular.

Would it be relatively simple to flip rep (and the automatic hide post) behavior?

I mean, make positive rep act like negative rep and negative rep act like positive rep?

And, just a question, my user icon just disappeared, does this have anything to do with me getting downvoted, or is it just a random glitch?

not sure why you would want to flip rep.

Yes there is a problem and it is being worked on. Should be fixed soon.