Nah, this likely isn't what you think it is about. I discovered I had a cancelled session today, which I wasn't notified about, other than the slot in Outlook. This client has had some infrastructure changes and challenges going on with their MS ecosystem, so I tried to get hold of the contact to see if there was a mistake and after several hours of chasing around, 10 minutes before the session was meant to start, I found out that they had moved the slot to a later time, but hadn't sent the invite to me. Even if I had received the invite, the problem is that there was also no confirmation that a later time would be available in my schedule, which it isn't, as I have back to back meetings.
Talking with a friend yesterday who is in a very different business but has lots of meetings also, she was talking about similar things. What she has noticed is the longer people have been at home, the less socially capable they have become, as they take less consideration of the time of others and forget a lot of the formalities of social engagements - like communicating updates in times. People seem to have forgotten that they do not live in a bubble as an individual, there are others involved.
Speaking of which - downvotes on Hive aren't censorship. I know that this is seemingly a bit of a pivot from the above story, but I have come across several of these claims again recently, as people have got downvoted for whatever reason. Downvoting isn't stealing rewards either, as there is a 7-day negotiation window that allows for "adjustment" to take place within the community. For those that don't like this, there are other platforms out there like Blurt (I think) that doesn't have downvotes and Steem where those with stake are so busy upvoting themselves, that they don't downvote. Everyone has options and this platform is opt-in.
Having said that, I would like to also like to talk about what is "fair" because often people will cite fairness of a downvote on their post, but I am yet to see anyone complain about the fairness of the upvotes on their post. However, the same people will complain about the fairness of upvotes on other people's posts.
There are a couple large accounts out there that do not care what they vote on, as long as they get a decent curation return and some of what they are voting on is quite terrible. Is it fair upvoting, or if you for example saw a whale upvoting themselves 10x a day, would you want that activity curbed. If you don't know how the platform works, it is absolutely possible for everyone to vote themselves 10x a day to maximize their rewards and essentially there are only two mechanisms to combat the situation - first is downvoting, the second is social culture, where behavior is influenced by peer group consideration.
Essentially, the rewards pool is a shared wallet where stake can allocate its contents. If everyone who could just voted for themselves at a maximum, the pool would be perfectly shared to those with stake, based on their percentage owned in relation to the total percentage voting. In this scenario, the system breaks down very, very fast, which is why when about 40% of the stake was voting on 1% of the posts during the bidbot era, there were a few highly rewarded posts, but the majority of posts got very little of the rewards pool. I don't think anyone other than the vote sellers want to go back to those times.
What ended those times was the introduction of "free" downvotes to combat abuse, where a downvote could remove the profit margin for the vote buyer, making it unprofitable to purchase and by the law of supply and demand, demand dried up. The other thing that had an effect was the move to 50% curation rewards, as in combination, this made the margin of selling votes smaller in comparison, and the downvotes 33% larger in effect to trim the margin into a loss.
Not many content creators seemed to complain, other than those buying votes, but what many haven't acknowledged is, on average, the average person is actually getting voted more, as rather than the 40% of total stake going to 1% of users who pay for it, that 40% is now being spread across many more users, as much of that stake become active again or delegated to curation services that pay a curation percentage back to them. However, there are still a few large accounts that don't care what they vote on. In general, it is these that are targeted by downvotes, to encourage better curation and rarely is the entire upvote negated. There are other downvotes on activities through added beneficiaries, which is a form of both vote buying and selling, as well as self-voting.
Regardless of how you personally feel about downvotes on your own posts, the thing is that all over the platform there are things going on that you probably don't know about and downvoting activities that you actually benefit from, if you are a content creator or investor here. Most people didn't take part in the downvoting of vote buyers, but everyone benefited from those who did. For those who complain about downvotes who understand this, you are being quite dishonest in your position, as you have personally benefited from downvoting activities, you just don't want it to happen to you.
But, downvotes get taken personally when they are on "my post", don't they? The consideration doesn't come into why I got downvoted, I just see it as a reflection of my work or some kind of vendetta against me. But, this is par for the course because I believe that all the upvotes I get are a sensitive appreciation of what I have created here - no matter that many of the upvoters are voting blind.
But, as I have said many times before, there is more nuance in the ecosystem and community than looking at individual votes on individual posts, as there is a track-record and value-add factor that can build a wide range of relationships. Is it fair that some people have put in the work to develop understanding and content as well as build relationships, while others expect the same rewards?
Fairness doesn't really come into it, does it, because everyone believes that they are deserving of the reward and no one believes they are deserving of the downvotes. The problem is, that isn't nuanced and it definitely isn't objective. While "quality and value of content" is subjective, so to is our evaluation of ourselves and what we bring to the table, with each likely overvaluing their own contributions. This is especially true when there aren't available metrics to know precisely what adds value, but I think that we have a pretty good understanding of what doesn't likely add value to the community.
What I think is going to be interesting after the next hardfork is that users will not have very much reason to try to maximize curation returns, which means that they should be looking to add value to their stake instead, rather than mass. What I mean by this is that curation becomes a kickback feature with most people voting getting the same percentage return - but where the real value is going to be is using that stake to increase the price of the HIVE token in general, as doing that will see more gains than the current process of maximizing stake. Do you get more benefit from earning an extra 10% on your stake or, increasing the value of the token 100%?
Not only this, because the automated maximization and curation window is removed, all manual curators are likely to see a significant increase in their curation returns, as they aren't being muscled out of gains by early bot voters looking for maximum returns. This is similar to the change downvotes brought to cut the bidbots out of e system so that the pool was distributed further.
I think that the problem a lot of people have with downvotes is that they look at it from an individual level and even if it is on only one of their posts, they treat it like their whole world has just been given a slap in the face. This triggers an inflated reaction to the importance of it and they "take to the streets2 to complain to whoever will listen about how unfair it all is and how they are being targeted, no matter how random it actually was.
I have a bit of experience under my belt here and I will let you in on a little secret - Downvotes don't cause death. And another - It is the people who complain about them that end up damaging themselves, as they broadcast just how "about the money" they actually are, no matter how many times they have "honestly" broadcast that they only care about the content, they aren't here for the money. Downvotes don't affect content, they are not censorship - but they do affect the rewards.
The other thing they broadcast is how emotionally triggered they are and how quick they can be to jump into a victim mentality. One of the things that I liked to see from @taskmaster4450 recently, as while he was getting heavily flagged for what I think was the first time consistently in his time here, he just kept on doing what he was doing - his content came first. I have done the same over the years when it has happened to me.
Content is King.
It isn't King because it attracts value, it is king when people put it first in their minds, regardless of the votes it does or doesn't get. What you will likely notice in the people who get consistently voted well is, they have also been consistently putting their content first. They of course like earning on their content too, but come rain or shine, they are here putting their content at the forefront of their experience, because it is an expression of themselves and their opinions, it is what they have to offer the community. The votes that do or do not arrive are what they are on individual posts, but those that arrive consistently are often (not always) the result of consistently putting content before vote.
Consistency is a key, but it isn't just consistency in delivering content, it is consistency in delivering a personality. When someone is constantly triggered by this or that, constantly screaming and throwing a tantrum whenever something doesn't go their way, while it can create some popcorn moments, it isn't going to earn the respect and support of anyone in the community who really values the community and content itself. Tantrums don't add value, however the conversation around them and the "lessons learned" for those observing can be valuable, just not to the person throwing the tantrum.
This is a small platform with a very diverse range of users and belief systems and if you are triggered by every thing that doesn't mesh with your belief system, you are going to be in for a bad time or at least, one that is quite volatile. Some people enjoy the drama, but for most, it is a flash in the pan interest level, a "one rant wonder" kind of event. If your approach to attention is drama over content, your audience isn't going to stick around long. The internet is full of random drama - not many people can deliver interesting content consistently.
So, while my training event was cancelled, my content for the afternoon wasn't - even if it does get downvoted into obscurity, it will still be here on the blockchain, as will the next piece and the next piece after that, as well as all the ones that came before it.
I have no control over anyone's vote. I own my content.
Taraz
[ Gen1: Hive ]
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I think downvotes are a tricky subject. If you are not abusing the platform and you happen to get one it is very understandable and easy to take it personally. Especially when you have put so much time and effort into a post. I try not to use them any more than I have to and only when I see obvious abuse. It just feels like I am being a crappy human being otherwise.
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But for people who have been here for years, I think they should understand the platform enough and just wear it. I very recently saw a tantrum from someone who has been here for almost as long as me.
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Yeah, I get that, but it still stings if suddenly out of the blue you are hit like that.
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It can definitely sting - but over time, a pain tolerance is built :)
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Awesome. Me too. I did a test and downvoted a few whales to see what would happen. Just a few pennies .... It was interesting to see how each reacted. Every single one revenge downvoted all my posts to zero except for one. That was you. It was a good test.
Not sure about which whales would downvote you - I will have a look later :D
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indeed, it's amazing to see the difference to the bidbot era.
Much nicer, isn't it? There are still issues of course, but that is always going to be the case with anything social and complex.
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Living in Bubbles not respecting other peoples time is a problem that has raised it's head, not having to present themselves personally, just moving meetings around does not work. Nor phoning at all odd hours of the night expecting an answer!
Voting system is not something to get upset with, yes walked that road as well, not everyone will like what you do, hope they find peoples content they do enjoy! Wish them well and carry on!
Good message to share, have seen a few people upset by downvotes, wasting precious time over one downvote, not worth it.
@tipu curate
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The respect f time has seemingly gone out the window and I think that it is only going to get worse. What I think people will find is that there will be somewhat of a backlash, where the people's whose time they want, will increasingly become unavailable and those who waste time, will be increasingly isolated.
It is amazing how upset some people get in such a short time.
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Stress paralysis appears to have hit many, leaving a void. Life carries on, we must keep moving forward, structuring time, which is the one factor that appears to escape far too quickly.
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If you have valid reason for downvotes than I guess it's good. But if people starts downvoting each other if they don't like the content or if they don't like the user then that's not good o think.
In general, most large accounts don't downvote because they don't like the content, there is generally another reason, like to counteract some other kind of abuse.
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Only for as long as we have witnesses though! No witnesses, no signed blocks, no HIVE.
So for any of the newer members of HIVE that still haven't voted for witnesses, I'd like to take this opportunity to nudge you to do so -
It's as simple as one, two three...
1.
2.
3.
~Josie~
Yep, i tis good for new members to realize they can get to know their witnesses too :)
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This is something people need to really think about. Two or three pieces of content down voted to nullify some excessive up votes, does not a trend make does nor a target make and when bitched, whined, and moaned about, results in the above.
Before bitching, moaning, groaning, or whining, people need to look at and evaluate the why of the vote, it is not a hard thing to do.
It is fun though to read a few post from well meaning people trying to explain the culture of Hive and the down vote.
It is fun indeed and it is good to get different perspectives on how people see the system. Effectively, none of them are wrong, it is all up to community culture. There are many cultures here, some are more valuable than others.
My job requires clear engagement and communication amongst employees. If, for instance, someone dislikes a procedure or performance during a monitored activity, the person observing must issue a notification. The notification is an electronic report of an observed deficiency. The expectation of that person's report is to state the observed issue and why it is an issue.
The person receiving the deficiency must acknowledge it and prepare a resolution to address the problem or speak with the originator to discuss further. The goal here is to resolve either the deficiency or someone's knowledge error to prevent its recurrence. Also, you have to be professional about it, or you could be cited or lose your job. I've learned this part from experience.
I see downvotes similarly. I see it as a mark against performance. I instinctively want to address the issue and record it, so I don't have to do it again. A common problem, however, is that it's difficult to trace the origin of the downvote. I only wish the voter added an explanation other than just the vote. I don't see downvotes as some horrid experience or something to worry about. I do see it as an underutilized tool with great potential to improve and align content to the platform's goals.
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It is good to have accountability when it comes to communication and performance. The difference with downvotes is that a lot f them are just made for nuiance purposes, especially the smaller ones. There used to be trails of downvotes from some users who were just doing it to be annoying and get a reaction. For the most part, big or small, best to ignore. Often, the large downvoters will give a reason for the downvote - but not always.
I saw the downvote streak on you post and on my comment the other day. It did made me frown upon a bit, also somewhere else in the week I was downvoted by a trail. Both of these were by accident and both by people who want to do right.
But even it wasnt so. I lifted an eyebrow and continued with my normal game. It is good to have downvotes for the general balance. How people used them, sometime will not always turn out for the best. But it will never stop me and the normal posting, it might just itchy hurt a bit ;)
(that being said is with only some occasional downvotes here and there. I have seen other users get bashed in downvote wars and that would be kind of demotivating even though eventually they will stop. I guess mentally that would be demotivating at some point)
Yeah, it was a test for someone i think. Nothing wrong with DVs and I think after the next hardfork, people might have to get a bit ore comfortable using theirs.
For the most part, the DVs for nuisance purposes are small or are pointed at large accounts.
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very nice
Nice article, very well written. I disagree to an extent and here is why. It's good to learn your opinion on the topic.
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