The News
As usual I will start with a price chart.
HIVE$ is much the same as it was a month ago. Everything seems fairly stable for now, but we get the odd spike. I think we need steady growth. There have to be reasons for people to buy $HIVE, such as needing resource credits to be active.
I was happy to see that @splinterrents is active again. Their service was stopped due to changes in how Splinterlands rentals worked, but it is back.
The next HPUD is in a few days. If you power up as little as 10HP you get a badge and may qualify for the prizes.
There is discussion of the future of the SPORTS token. We have so many secondary tokens on Hive and some lack utility apart from being able to stake them for voting. I have used their tag for years and bought some, but the value is still not much. I wonder what it takes to make such tokens more valuable.
@ssekulji completed his first rally in the Hive car. This gets the brand in front of millions of eyes. We need to be ready to welcome curious newcomers.
Friday Follows
- @radioliquorice puts together a show of music by a community that I helped start in a local pub. They are open to guest artists if you want to submit some songs for next time.
- I just saw that @bozz hit 50k HP. That is a nice milestone. He has a little further to go to qualify as a Hive Orca. That is based on the VEST tokens that underlie the blockchain. You can see what you have on the @hivebuzz site.
- My friend @anna-newkey has been busy with open mic sessions as well as daily walks with her dog Mia. She just got a treadmill so she can get extra steps whilst working from home. She is active in the Hive open mic challenge.
- Another friend @steve-o2023 departs next week on his much delayed motorbike trip to distant parts. He plans to do posts and videos along the way.
The Doghouse
I do find myself defending Hive a fair bit. Much as I love the platform it is imperfect, as I often say. It can seem unfair and unfriendly to some. We need to do our best to improve on that.
The latest incident I saw was around @cast.garden. This is a service for publishing podcasts that was created by @kencode under his @agorise brand. I found it when looking for an alternative to commercial services. You can upload episodes that can be subscribed to with any 'podcatcher' application (I use Pocket Casts on my Android phone). You can also consume them within the Cast Garden site that looks a little like some of the video sites. Podcasts can be video if you want.
All the podcasts appear on the feed from @cast.garden. This is not really how people would consume them, but you can upvote them with 90% of the rewards going to the creator and 10% to the service. Creators can share these posts to their own feed or communities for more visibility. Recently some of the posts have been downvoted to nothing by the @hivewatchers accounts with no reason given. I could guess that it could be due to the content having been posted elsewhere or that there are too many posts, but this is pure guesswork. I know some people have had concerns about projects @kencode has run before, but he is building useful apps on the blockchain and there ought to be ways to make that possible without fights breaking out.
I have noticed that some who use Cast Garden are not actually using Hive. They do not comment and do not even seem to collect their rewards. They may earn in other ways from what they do. They will not even notice the downvotes. Others will and feel it is not justified.
It is not my job to defend Hivewatchers. Their actions can be very divisive, but they have done a lot to stop people earning from unethical behaviour such as plagiarism or impersonation. The project gets funded via the proposals and so I think they do need to be accountable to the community. That includes making it clear why people have been downvoted. Those affected can appeal via Discord, but this needs to be a fair process that encourages rehabilitation or forgiveness rather than just punishment. Their web site is not too helpful. You can look up some people who have been verified and report abusers, but it has not been updated in a long while. There is a big list of blacklisted accounts that you can download to use in your own scripts, but it does not give reasons.
Hivewatchers come in for lots of abuse with some 'victims' trying to dox those who downvote. Some whales and other big accounts will get involved to help out, but that does not necessarily mean they are trying to drive away small accounts. Some say they want to keep the rewards for themselves, but if they make Hive an unattractive platform then they stand to lose on their investment.
I know some people delegate their HP to curation accounts, including Hivewatchers, or follow up/downvote trails. I think you need to be careful in this as you lose control of how your voting power is used. The big curation account concentrate where the votes go and I think they need to be spread more. If you do not have time to vote manually then I think it may be better to follow the trail of someone you trust. I do downvote, but it is always manual so I know exactly what impact it has.
People will suggest improvements such as expiring delegations or a need to comment when downvoting, but these need to get witness approval and so discussion needs to happen rather than making threats. I think most people would favour minimising the restrictions the platform puts on us and then it is up to people to deal with bad behaviour. That does allow bad actors to be unkind, but freedom is important.
I find it frustrating when elements of the community are fighting amongst themselves when we need to be building an attractive platform. If you scare people away they tend to spread bad vibes. I am not saying we should tolerate abuse, but we need to find ways to work with projects that can add value.
The End
I needed to get all that off my chest. Feel free to give your opinions in the comments.
I always that I encourage others to support the community. #FollowFriday is one way I do that, but it is not exclusively mine. I also do the #BritList with a fresh edition next week. I hope to see more people active around the UK. We need some dormant accounts to come back.
Hive five!
 |
The man behind: | @tenkminnows: Helping good Hivers level up @proofofbrian: A bot that checks for tag typos #BritList: A monthly list of Hivers in the UK |
Exactly. Voting for a Witness or delegating your Hive Power (HP) to someone, just because that's who the mob is voting for, doesn't make it the right decision.
Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts, absolutely. I think that most everyone has seen this in some way.
For Witnesses, votes decay. 💪
So, I propose this:
HP earns you ~3% interest too. It's not great, but it's a good start. 😊
Democracies are mob rule. Mobs are chaos and the only people who benefit from the chaos are the ones who have been given such power.
I vote for DE-centralisation, therefore I have changed which Witnesses I vote for.
In my wallet, I have also removed HP delegations that are no longer needed.
We get to use our HP to influence the course of Hive and that is one of its strengths. Our witness votes do expire eventually. I use all my votes to support those who I see doing good work.
I want people to think about whether what they do is good for Hive. We all stand to win if it does well.
Honestly, @steevc .... it doesn't SEEM unfair and unfriendly to some, but it IS unfair and unfriendly sometimes. We have situations in which even the newest Hivers will get upvoted by one whale and down by another just because Whale B doesn't want Whale A to grow. Imagine being here TWO DAYS and having that happen to you. That's NOT FAIR. Imagine having @hivewatchers slamming you when nobody has even shown you yet how you have to operate on Hive. Those of us who have been around Hive understand what is going on and can generally work around issues until whatever fight is resolved -- but if we are doing this to New Hivers who are still learning, we are also committing community self-destruction. It's not just a FEW PEOPLE.
SERIOUSLY: as a professional journalist, I advise anyone serious about the issue to look away from happy Hivers on Twitter and notice how there is an entirely different narrative with some big influencers in it. SERIOUSLY: the powers that be on Hive need to do research on the impression they are leaving, and understand: BAD NEWS travels much faster than good. We have maybe this bear and the next bull to figure this out before some critical masses are going to be hit on that subject, particularly with the regulatory environment shifting. The last thing Hive needs is to have a DV tick off someone that can have the SEC and its EU counterpart looking around in here since even Blocktrades, WHO HELPED FOUND HIVE, has already given up on Hivers in the U.S.! And with that foolery done over on @cast.garden, we are about to tick off the entire Fediverse, veterans of decentralization that are a natural match for Hive's growth:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fediverse
Have a look at that. Would Hive rather have FRIENDS in a network like that, or ENEMIES, over a few weekends of DVs worth a few hundred dollars?
New people come to Hive needing to learn what to do and how to work here ... Hiving responsibility needs to be practiced by those with big votes too. Does @hivewatchers even have a Hive Best Practices sheet that it can drop on people as a correctional matter before DVing them forever and a day for not knowing what best practices are? Can a new platform like @cast.garden BREATHE, and problems be discussed and worked out without the need for a blanket DV? Can we even talk to the whales not DVing each other on even New Hivers's post so everybody doesn't get trampled underfoot as they come in here?
We're all adults here -- it's not that things seem unfair, @steevc. Often times they are, and we as a community are going to either address that fact and fix it or have that fact cripple Hive in the long run. I'm not the first to say it and I'm sure I won't be the last, because IT IS TRUE.
I agree with a lot of this. Hive has been held back by scaring off good people. Anyone giving out downvotes has to appreciate that will be taken badly by some. We are losing users anyway, as I know from the #BritList where most of the people I have found are inactive. The big players have it in their power to make it better, but we all play a part. I have spent so much time trying to persuade people to stay. Sometimes that works.
We do have plenty of trolls and some have a big stake. I think they are a small minority though and we cannot let them dominate. There is so much good stuff going on here and many people are mostly unaware of what we are discussing. It is often the case that problems get over-emphasised and we should get things in perspective.
Hive is different to other platforms. We have freedom and that includes freedom to be a dickhead. There is no overall boss, but those with power have to decide what future it could have. It won't necessarily be what they would like. It may not be all carefully researched articles by experts. It could have lots of cat pictures. Short posts can exist here as well as long ones. The community can decide what they are worth.
We do need to deal with various forms of abuse though. That has to be done fairly and transparently. There are organised groups who will create lots of accounts specifically to milk rewards. Others will be badly advised about what Hive is. It can be hard to tell which is which, but new users should be given a chance to prove themselves and they should be able to find guidance.
I think we can be better and it is worth trying.
!BEER
I do believe Hive can and if we want it to be relevant in the future MUST BE better... I hear you when you say problems get over-emphasized at times, but remember: everybody going out the door is leaving with NOTHING BUT THE PROBLEMS, so the longer we fail to get serious about resolving the problems that keep recurring, the more people there are going to be that know just the problems.
I of course understand that freedom involves freedom for people to act a straight fool, but let me tell you from across the Pond from you ... oh say can you see the cleanup we are having to do here when the fools run wild for a few years? How long do you think it will take for the reputation of the United States to recover? Freedom is wonderful ... but you know, justice for abusers and fairness toward users had better come with it. Hive needs to get a REAL sense of that just as much as my beloved country -- and SOON! I'm here to work for that in both places!
I am well aware that every person we drive away will tell others not to bother with Hive. You can see plenty of that on Blurt. We have to get the balance right of dealing with actual abuse and it isn't easy.
I probably care too much about this stuff :)
Well, Hive needs MORE PEOPLE who care, just this much -- so you are doing a GREAT JOB!
I have had similar concerns about Hivewatchers. You'd think that given they are DHF funded that they would spend some time and money fixing up their website and the procedures that people that have been downvoted or blacklisted can use to contest or appeal Hivewatchers actions.
I'm disappointed that this issue has not been fixed as I've raised it on a number of occasions over the past few years.
They seem to cause more disputes than just about anything else. We do have some feuds amongst big accounts that do not help matters. Too many egos involved.
Hive needs defending, but that should be about serving the community rather than ruling it. Sounds like real-life policing in some places.
Well, delegating your HP to someone else does not really seem well to me. You can still keep your HP and engage more and make more money than waiting for votes from the accounts to which you have delegated.
Delegating to get voted is like buying votes and that is not encouraged. If your vote is small then use it well.
I do delegate, but to curators I know and admire, and some pay some back, so I am more than happy to support them.
I wouldn't delegate because I think they might like me more.. lol
because they wouldn't.. 😄
Exactly. I wish more people would vote that way. The Hive community as a whole needs to take their power back.
We can each decide how to use our stake. Of course people want to earn, but you can do it just by voting. Most of my voting is manual.
Whenever I bring a new user to Hive, I delegate 10 to 20 HP to them for a short while, at least until they can get their first post out and tweak their blog page images and stuff. After that though, I always take back my HP. It's also nice to earn around 3% on that HP too :)
Thanks, Steve!! It would be good to get some more people on Radio Liquorice for sure!
You share your own podcast? I might have missed them.. I find cast.garden a little confusing to pinpoint something I actually want to listen to, like yours for example, but maybe I just need to have another look..
I plan to power up a little more this time.. are those prizes linked to a post? I will post anyhow, but not quiet clear on that.
With regards to the Hivewatchers: It feels a little Kafkaesque, one is at the mercy of the big fish in the pond.. There is no control mechanism controlling the controllers? lol
My show is here.
I do not think the 'minnows' should have to be afraid of the big fish, but it can be like that. As HW are being paid by the community then they should be answerable, but it is really to the whales who gets proposal funding. Hive can be like the wild west where 'might is right', but I think it should be compassionate and try to be fair. We are all people and there needs to be respect on both sides.
!BEER
AH, cool! Thanks for the link! You've got a new subscriber.. lol
It would be nice if it was like that! As you say, the people who have been here for a long time rely on new people joining, and people need guidance if something isn't quite right.. How can you learn? Remember when I supposedly double-posted at the beginning?
Which reminds me.. if I see someone using images without a source, should I ask? I suppose I should check online if I find them, but if I do, should I politely raise the point?
It doesn't help that it is unclear what the 'rules' are when you join. Those who mess up early on ought to be given some advice before a full-on attack starts. I bet some just give up and we don't want that.
Exactly! It's frustrating enough if you try to do the write thing, spend time on writing posts, connecting and the rest of it, only to be downvoted.. Don't blame them if they give up!
DVs do get peoples' attention, but give them a chance first and don't make good people jump through hoops to get forgiven.
So, I've subscribed, but I fail to see a list of my subscriptions anywhere.. Suppose I'll have to bookmark your link..
You can get an RSS link to use in podcast apps. I need to do another one soon.
Where? I've noticed it stops as soon as I go elsewhere..
Starting episode 5 soon.. Great stuff!
On the episodes there is a subscription options dropdown.
There will always be theives and people trying to stop them. In the battle between these two factions we will have collateral damage and there needs to be a good way to resolve disputes without getting into flag wars.
They have to have a use case. I'm stacking a little HBD because it offers 20% interest on savings.
Many of these low value second layer tokens seem to have been abandoned or are still in development so it's difficult to see what is worth stacking?
!PIZZA
Of course everyone wants that 'free money', but not all want to play fair. I think flag wars are fairly rare, but then you can't compete with a whale. People just get all riled up when they get a downvote, but it's part of the system and we need to talk to settle disputes rather than throwing our toys out of the pram.
!BEER
I've removed my delegation to all voting trails some time ago because I wasn't impressed with the results.
There will always be drama but it's avoidable if we keep the dialogue open and on the issue rather than the ego's of those involved.💯👍🏼
If I come across someone who is getting downvoted, and it is not obvious why, I always go and check with HiveWatchers. Two accounts that commented on one of my posts recently were getting downvotes and it turned out that their accounts may have been compromised in some way. I passed on the info, then Hivewatchers helped both accounts to sort out the problem.
I know they can be responsive on Discord, but not everyone will see that. It is not an easy job, but more transparency would help people understand what is going on. They do some posts that list posts they dealt with, but those are not very readable. They don't accept proxy appeals, so if people won't go to Discord then the downvotes may continue. The punishment needs to be proportionate.
I agree and I have challenged them about posts that were getting downvotes and those accounts have been removed from the blacklist. I'm also not mad about some of the more cult-like requirements for transgressors. But at the same time, I feel a better
solutionapproach is going and speaking directly to them when you see something that you don't agree with.I know the Cast Garden guy has reached out. In this case it's hurting the podcast creators, even if some don't realise it.
Okay, I get that. I'm not going to take up this particular case as I don't know enough about it. I'm not only talking about the people directly affected by downvotes talking to Hive Watchers, I'm talking about any of us. As you say, some of these activities have an adverse effect on Hive. I personally wouldn't run the service as it is being run, but then again, I'm not prepared to take it on. So I have to work with Hive Watchers and help to change things where I can.
Thanks for the shout out! I am hoping to hit Orca here soon. I've had a decent run of some good rewards lately, so that definitely helps!
I'll have to check out that post about the SPORTS token. I kind of gave up on them, but I still have my secondary account that has a rather large stake.
You do a lots of sports posts, so it could affect you. I think they want people to help run it, but that would not pay much.
I was part of the referee program back when they had it. It was interesting the stuff that people tried to get away with. I think part of the problem to begin with was the tokenomics. It never really recovered after that.
Getting the economic side right is not easy and people will always try to cheat. I don't need that sort of hassle.
I agree!
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Thanks for this post, it makes me think.
@bhabb steve writes this good weekly hive news letter and round up, you might find interesting and helpful. He is also a fellow parkrunner. Follow and add him to your favorites and it should show up on your feed.
!BEER
$PIZZA slices delivered:
@molometer(1/5) tipped @steevc
Subscribed successfully :)
The real web3 experience is sponsored by the most devastatingly tight moderation that I know of. Touch one for sure.
Hello.
cast.garden was initially reported as spam as it seems to be a service identical to tdvtv (Dollar Vigilante).
The service basically cross-posts content with no engagement with the community and is self-voted by the owner.
A few communities have already muted cast.garden for spamming their tags with junk posts with irrelevant content (Hive Open Mic, Cinnamon Cup Coffee, Puku Mundo).
cast.garden is not blacklisted. There will be no more downvoting from HW.
We are not responsible for downvotes from the community.
P.S. tdvtv was asked a year ago by some stakeholders to decline rewards on the posts as it was farming the rewards (although it seems that it started to farm again).
Thanks for responding. I've talked to @kencode and I hope there can be dialogue about what is acceptable. He told me about automatic posting to communities and I said I thought that could be problematic. I prefer manual control of where things go. I do think that getting podcasts onto Hive can add value if it's done right.
Yep, me too :)
See the agorise reply below. Hopefully that clears it up and opens the dialogue with the whales that control Hive.