[Analysis] The factors influencing Steem's retention rate

in #utopian-io3 years ago (edited)

Steem Analysis

How to lower the churn rate (or increase the retention rate) on Steem ?




Source : LiveChatInc.com

Repository

Steem
https://github.com/steemit/steem

Analysis
https://github.com/algo-coder/steem-retention-stats

Table of Contents

  1. General introduction
  2. General Statistics about churn / retention rates
  3. The influence of Apps
  4. The influence of Tags
  5. The influence of Powering Up
  6. The influence of Payouts
  7. Conclusion
  8. Tools and requests used (+ Github repository)


General Introduction


First of all, a big thanks to @crokkon for the encouragements and advices he gave me on my latest post and on Discord.

Also a big thanks to @paulag and her article (How to Engage and Retain Users (Backed up with Steemit Data) that gave me the idea to dig deeper on the subject.

This analysis assumes that churn rates on Steem are high (based on @paulag's conclusion) and that some behaviours / initiatives (participating in @abh12345's Curation and Engagement Leagues for example) play a big role in retaining users on the platform.
The average drop-off day for new users (excluding accounts with no activity ever) is the 75th (see @paulag's post) after the creation of the account.
So the question is : What differentiates (on average) a user that leaves at day 75 or before, and a user that stays after that delay ?

I thought of four main explainations : apps, tags, powering up and payouts. We will look at data (one factor after the other) and see if we can determine a clear data gap between users who leave and users who stay. Of course there's a lot of other factors that could come into play, but those are quantifiable and data-friendly, and a lot of more "subjective" factors (Are you alone or did you come on Steem invited by a friend, a spouse ? Were you already a blogger or not ? Are you on a lot of other social medias ? Are you an investor or a content creator ?) are expressed indirectly in these four main explainations.

So we will check on all Steem accounts created before today minus 90 days and see their activity in the first 75 days following the account's creation. If the account is still active (with a post, a vote or an account update) after 75 days (no matter if it's still active today or not), we will classify it as "Active". If not, it will be considered as "Inactive".
An account with no post or comment at all is considered as "Never Active". An account with only activity in the first two days (48 hours) also (little differences with @paulag's classification but necessary for eliminating all the noise possible from the data). "Never Active" accounts are excluded from the analysis.

General Statistics


Active, Inactive and Never Active accounts by date of creation



Here we have general statistics about account activity depending on the date of the account's creation. Dates of creation are grouped by months.

All the data in bars are in percentage of the accounts created that month (left y-axis) :

  • In red, the "Never Active" accounts (in percentage) that are excluded from our analysis.
  • In blue, the "Inactive" accounts, for which the activity stops at day 75 or before.
  • In green, the "Active" accounts, who still show some activity after day 75.

On the secondary y-axis (on the right), the number of accounts created each month (the grey line).

Statistics for all 878 176 accounts:
64.34 % (565 049) are classified "Never Active",
18.14 % (159 308) are classified "Inactive",
17.52 % (153 869) are classified "Active."


Observations

What could explain so many "Never Active" accounts ?
First of all, the first months of Steem are exceptional with PoW and its system where multiple accounts were needed (read this somewhere, I'm not sure as I wasn't there). So a lot of accounts then were created for the sole purpose of mining. But we also see that it concerns a really low number of accounts.

For me (personal opinion), I think that the main cause of these "Never Active" accounts is the time it takes to validate an account. People nowadays want instant results, and by the time they receive the e-mail to definitively activate their Steem account and get the password, they already forgot about their Steem sign-up.
I don't have access to the data, but it would be really nice to compare the mean time of account validation (by month of creation) to the percentage of "Never active" accounts.
And for sure, the STEEM / USD price has an influence on this percentage too.


Accounts dropping off by day of presence



Here we see the drop-off day (x-axis) of the Inactive accounts, and the percentage of all Inactive accounts it represents (blue bars, left y-axis).

On the secondary y-axis (right), we see the percentage of Inactive accounts that already dropped off up until and including this day. So at day 75 we are at 100 % (all inactive accounts have dropped off). Remember, if an account drops off at day 76, it is considered active. By checking the intersection between a day, and the right (secondary) y-axis you can determine what percentage of Inactive accounts have dropped off before or at that number of days.

From this graph, we see that approximatively 62 % of all Inactive accounts have dropped off before or at day 30. So the most critical period for retaining new users is the first month.

After day 30, drop-off rate per day more or less stabilize. So we can assume that after that delay, we are confronted to a more structural churn rate. The next step would be to compare this residual churn rate with other social media platforms to see how does Steem compare with them.

We have a really big churn rate in the first few days. Maybe some people, reminded they signed up to Steem a week or two ago by the validating account e-mail, come to see what it is all about, post something or comment somewhere and then never come back.


The influence of Apps


Apps Retention Rates



How to read this graph ?

Here we see the influence on the apps used by the user on the retention rate. A score of a 100 means the application has no influence (And a 100 is the score of all apps). A score over a 100 means the application has a positive influence.

The calculation formula of the Retention Rate is as follows:

Calculating the Retention Rate (RR) of an app (or a tag)
First we define a ratio of activity (RA) for this app / tag with the following calculus:
Ratio of Activity (RA) = Percentage of accounts active (PAC) that used at least once this app / Percentage of accounts inactive (PAI) that used at least once this app.
And then adjust it with the global ratio of inactivity (GRI).


To be clearer, let's take an imaginary example :

For a given app, 1 000 users used it, 800 are classified active, 200 inactive.
This app has a percentage of accounts active (PAC) of 80 % (800 / 1000) and a percentage of inactive accounts (PAI) of 20 % (200 / 1000).
So its ratio of activity (RA) is 80 / 20 = 4 = 400 %
To explain this in words, let's say that if a user used this app, he has 4 times more chance to be active rather than inactive. But we can't stop there, because we need to adjust that result with the global ratio of inactivity (GRI).


For the adjustment with the global ratio of inactivity (GRI), let's explore three possibilites (taking the extremes and the middle ground) to show how the formula works :
Case n°1 - We have a global ratio of inactivity (GRI) of 10, meaning that (fictious numbers) x different active users used a mean of y apps (with x.y = 1 000) and at the same time k different inactive users used a mean of l apps (with k.l = 10 000). In this case, there's a lot more inactive users - approximatilvely 10 times - than active users (or we could also say that there are the same numbers of active and inactive users, but that inactive ones used a mean of 10 different apps, whereas active users used a mean of only 1 app, but let's suppose it's not the case for the sake of the analysis).
Case n°2 - We have a global ratio of inactivity (GRI) of 0.25 (x.y = 1 000 / k.l = 250), so there's 4 times more active users than inactive users).
Case n°3 - We have a global ratio of inactivity (GRI) of 0.1 (x.y = 1 000 / k.l = 100).


In our example, for this three possibilities, the final results will be

In the first case : the retention rate would be : 80 (PAC) / 20 (PAI) = 4 (RA) * 10 (GRI) = 40 * 100 = 4 000 % (RR)
In the second case : the retention rate would be 80 (PAC) / 20 (PAI) = 4 (RA) * 0.25 (GRI) = 1 * 100 = 100 % (RR)
In the third case : the retention rate would be 80 (PAC) / 20 (PAI) = 4 (RA) * 0.1 (GRI) = 0.4 * 100 = 40 % (RR)


What does it tell us ?

First case : Great retention rate (80 % active for this app / tag) when there are a lot of inactive users in general (10 times more than active) : the retention rate is 4 000 %, meaning that the app is 40 times better at retaining users than the mean of all apps.
Second case : No retention nor churn, 80 % active for the app, but same ratio on the global scale : the retention rate is 100 %, meaning the app has no influence on retaining users.
Third case : Bad retention rate (80 % active for the app but more than 9 accounts out of 10 are active) : 40 %, we could say that the app scares users away.


The most interesting (as the number of accounts using the apps are really different) is to interpret it in a relative way. Steemit being the main app used, it's normal that most inactive accounts only posted once with Steemit, and never tried other apps, or forgot about Steem altogether.

But a relative approach can tell us a lot about the potential of apps for improving the retention rates.

Let's take the two most used apps after Steemit:
1 -> Busy. A user that posted at least once with #busy is 372 / 84 = 4.42 times more likely to still be active after 75 days compared to a user that posted at least once with #steemit.
2 -> eSteem. A user that posted at least once with #esteem is 161 / 84 = 1.91 times more likely to still be active after 75 days compared to a user that posted at least once with #steemit.

Of course, some accounts posted with #busy and #steemit, being classified as active and inactive in both apps. But the gap between the Retention Rates (even if the formula can't be perfect because of this multi-apps users) clearly shows that the app used by the user has a great influence on the duration of his journey on the Steem blockchain.

Counter arguments

Of course, we can say that a lot of early dropping-off users are the main cause of the low retention rate of the Steemit app, because they have a great chance of having used only Steemit for interacting with the Steem Blockchain.
-> Yes, but that would be minimizing the importance of the User Interface, and as "Never Active" users aren't taken into account, it means that users came on #steemit, posted and then left, so, even if it's with no certainty, maybe Steemit was a factor in their decision of leaving the platform.

We can also say that people who took the time and made the efforts to discover other apps already decided in staying.
-> That's a possibility, but the only way to know would be to have a better "default" interface and then compare results with the retention rates of the current option that is Steemit as the default interface.


The influence of Tags


Tags Retention Rates (TOP 1 -> 50 most used tags)



Tags Retention Rates (TOP 51 -> 100 most used tags)



These graphs must be read the same way as the Apps one (it is using the same formula for calculating the Retention Rate). These statistics only take into account the main tags of posts.

The influence of tags is not as clear as the influence of applications. But there are still some useful informations to be extracted from this.

First we see that crypto-currency related tags have low retention rates: #bitcoin with 51, #cryptocurrency with 58, #crypto with 76.
Whereas casual tags have more success in retaining users : #history with 112, #philosophy with 128, #writing with 108, #culture with 123, #family with 126, #fiction with 129. All the authors posting at least once with one of these tags is at least 2 times more likely to still be active after 75 days than a user that posted with #bitcoin or #cryptocurrency.
But the most retaining tags are:


As I already said, the influence of tags doesn't seem to be as important as the influence of apps. But we clearly see some big trends here. Even if Steem is viewed as a crypto-related social media, in fact that's the field where the churn rate is the highest.
Whereas traditional subject areas have a much better retention rate.


The influence of Powering Up


STEEM Powered Up by Active / Inactive users



Here, there is no debate possible. Powering Up is an evident factor in retaining users.

A user who has powered up in his first 75 days is 4.51 times more likely to still be active after 75 days compared to a user who didn't power up.

If the influence of powering up is low (4.51 times is good, but still seems low as we're talking about people investing in Steem), we can object that the amount of Steem powered up should have been taken into account.
When looking at the figure, if we see that in terms of number of accounts we have 32 259 active accounts who powered up / 7 155 inactive accounts who powered up = 4.51, in terms of amount invested, the ratio would be more like 25 million / 140 thousands = 178, so the amount invested seems much more relevant than only the criteria of "Powering up".

Erratum : An error has crept in the numbers. Correction put the new ratio to 4.51 instead of 5.75. So no modification in the conclusion or anything. The Github has also been corrected.


The influence of Payouts


Payouts of Active / Inactive users


Mean of all active or inactive users


Here we see that Active users have received (in mean) a max payout of 1.773 $ in their first 75 days, whereas Inactive users received a max payout of 0.238 $ in the same period.
Active users received approximatively double payouts compared to inactive users.

Receiving a "big" payout during the first 75 days of arriving to Steem seems to be a clear and important factor on retention.


Counter arguments

Maybe the gap in all payouts are due to users using bid-bots or upvote-bots. I didn't take this information into account. If it's the case (that most max payouts from active users are due to the use of bid bots) then it would only mean (as the powering up aspect) that investing in Steem is a clear factor influencing the retention rate.

Conclusion


Time to draw some conclusions.
Every factor we studied has a clear influence on the retention rates, so how to act on it ?

For the app, it's clear that Steemit.com might be a factor in the high churn rate. Making the interface more user-friendly may have a big impact on the retention rate.

For the tags, we see the importance of community and carefully choosing the tags used. It's the difference between some and no visibility for a new user, hence having a strong impact on the retention rate. It also tells us that some aspects of Steem (if discovered by the user), especially the technical ones, have a positive influence on the retention rate (witnesses, curation, etc.).

Powering up clearly shows that people who invest in Steem are here to stay. That's the most trivial conclusion, as Powering Down takes 13 weeks...

Payouts also show that real tangible results on a user's post encourage him to stay.


How to correct the course ? (Personal opinions)

  1. Steemit Inc. must put UX / UI as its number one priority for its developers (I know that's not the current priority) because it's clearly an important lever to retain users on the platform.
  2. Steemit Inc. should delegate more of its Steem Power to community-driven accounts, as they're the ones having a big influence on retention rates. It should also explain better to new users (maybe some tutorials, a clearer FAQ, some "pinned" posts) some technical aspects of Steem, as it seems to be a clear factor in retention once it's understood.
  3. Instead of delegating Steem Power to new accounts (or maybe delegate less), it would be better used in "moderating" or "community" accounts that would upvote newcomers' posts. People don't realize that the 15 SP delegation from @steemit is a big amount. They seem, on the other hand, really responsive (in terms of retention) when being "correctly" rewarded soon in their Steem journey.


Tools and requests used


All data was extracted with @arcange's SteemSQL.
All data manipulation was made with Python.

All scripts used are in this Github repository :
https://github.com/algo-coder/steem-retention-stats

General information about the files in the repository
The script extraction.py takes approximatively 360 minutes (6 hours) to fully execute, its role is to retrieve the raw data from SteemSQL, and then transform it into what will be needed for the next script, and storing it in a local MySQL Databse. Progress information are displayed every 5 seconds in the console.
The script stats.py takes approximatively 10 minutes to run, it will put some stats in the console and generate 6 graphs that will be saved in the directory the script is in.
The file table.sql contains the SQL instructions for the creation of the table needed for the local MySQL database.




Thanks for reading !


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Awesome piece of content! From my point of view retention is our main issue on Steem.

Too sad I found your brilliant analysis after the 7 days time period. Would've loved to resteem this. However, I'll share it in my chatrooms ;-)

Thanks for the great work!

Thanks a lot for your kind words !

Retention is clearly a major issue on Steem. It's too bad a lot of people only consider it of secondary importance.

Thanks for sharing my work, I hope my next analysis will be worthy of your resteem... Still need to find the idea though.

Are you on discord @algo.coder? I just reached out to someone using the same nick as you :-)
I have an idea - or rather a wish? - for an analysis and would love to discuss the idea with you!

Yes, it's me, I answered you !
Still haven't found my next analysis topic, so I'm open to suggestions :D

You're more than welcome, I really enjoyed your content and am following you now for more.

Please feel free to directly send me the link to your next analysis to make sure I won't miss it :-)

Very nice analysis!
Although it might be quite difficult to understand, especially for newcomers.

Good to see you earned an utopian.io upvote 😀

Thanks ! And I'm glad for Utopian-io upvoting me ! It feels good to have a decent return on the time invested.
And for the difficulty, well it wasn't really written with the newcomers in mind :D

This is a very interesting analysis of the situation... and I appreciate being able to see this data.

Of course, the thing we cannot measure readily is the Human Psychology angle. I would venture a very large percentage of inactives are the result of people having unrealistic expectations of the phrase "Get paid for creating content!" People see those words... perhaps presented in the context of someone like Jerry Banfield or the Dollarvigilante... so they give it a whirl for a week and then give up.

The other variable — more measurable — is the number of inactives tracked vs. the trendline on the price of Steem. When Steem declines, activity declines... people just get depressed and give up.

The above two factors — assume, of course, hat people's primary motivation for being involved is "to make money" rather than "to create content," or "to build a social media presence."

Personally, I am here for marketing reasons, not money reasons... the rewards are just a fringe benefit that makes this a more attractive proposition than so many other social platforms.

Thank you for the analysis!

As for your suggested "fixes," here are some thoughts:

On the UI: To this day I find it baffling to sit in 2018 and hard code my content in HTML. WTF? It's 2018; time for widget driven drag and drop. The whole HTML-3 "1998 message board" look doesn't work for the average web user... so much attrition could simply be due to "This is too hard to figure out." It's almost like the place was built by developers who are oblivious to the fact that not the entire world is a developer... The whole UI needs a massive overhaul and oversight by some professional Usability Engineers.

As for part two, that's a dodgy topic. STINC seems really more interested in the Steem blockchain than Steemit the front end. The energy and delegations seem to be mostly going towards those who wish to develop apps or create SMTs. On the surface, that might OK-ish... but the problem is that this focus is very "wholesale" oriented... end users (where we have the retention problem) is a "retail" issue. So metaphorically speaking, you can build the greatest shopping center in the world, but if there are no customers it doesn't amount to a damn thing!

As for the delegations for new accounts, I have no issue with it... BUT I think there needs to be a MUCH clearer message: "Hello and welcome to Steemit! We have LENT you 15SP to get you started, and which will be yours to work with for 60 days AND THEN WE TAKE IT BACK!" Right now, nobody knows how, what, where and how long it's for...

Thanks for your comment and kind words !
I agree with every word you say. But as I don't really like too consensual comments, I will try to add information (and oppose, with little will I confess) to the things you said.

For the expectations, of course (and I said it in another comment), people come here to make a quick buck, that's the main argument in Steemit promotion. "Do what you're already doing elsewhere, but make money in the process."
People leaving when they realize Steemit doesn't live up to its promises is OK with me, but if the site was well designed, comfortable to browse, maybe they would stay for the few bucks it can reward them with. There's a lot of nice people here, concerned people, great discussions taking place so for me, if the people are leaving when desillusioned about rewards, it also tells us they're leaving because they were ONLY doing it for the rewards. If the site was better than (or at least as good as) the competition, a bigger fraction of people would stay even with rewards lower than their first expectations.

For the price of STEEM, the link is clear (even if I didn't provide with data), but we're seeing it right now, since a few weeks.

For the fixes :

  1. On the UI : Totally, Steemit seems so outdated, only geeks can tolerate evolving in this kind of environment.
  2. For the delegations : yes Steem Inc. is only thinking about the Steem blockchain, but that could be a trap. For now Steemit is the only (almost) thing adding value to STEEM. Neglecting it could make STEEM go directly to the alt-coin cemetery by the time other things (SMTs, apps) become operational and adopted / used.
  3. I didn't think of it, it's a really good solution to the problem.

Thanks again for your well-constructed and informative comment !

I don't necessarily agree with your resolutions, primarily because of human responses to how rewards are distributed. Just because people have the ability to create content doesn't mean their work is worth being rewarded. And while user retention seems like an important thing, the reality is that many users should not be here because steemit does not improve the lives of most people, not yet atleast.

The resolutions I wrote about are really personal. And I'm not here since such a long time, so I still have a lot to learn about different opinions here on Steem (and about Steem). But for the sake of opposing something to your arguments, I will develop my point of view (on resolution 3 as it is the one you criticize).

First of all, let it be known that I partly agree with you.

Just because people have the ability to create content doesn't mean their work is worth being rewarded.

That's why I proposed that Steemit Inc. delegates Steem Power to already existing communities or new moderating accounts. So they can give the 15 SP in votes instead of a fixed delegation to users who are worth it. And moreover, it could not be considered as censure because anybody would still be able to spam / sh*t post and get upvotes from other accounts.
For me, delegating systematically 15 SP to every new account is rewarding people that aren't, in majority, worthy of it. And it encourages circle voting and other schemes. From the Steemit Inc.'s point of view, it is less "blocked" currency, and that liberated Steem Power could be used in much more efficient ways (in terms of retention and distribution) by delegating it to existing communities' accounts or new accounts made for specific tasks.


And while user retention seems like an important thing, the reality is that many users should not be here because steemit does not improve the lives of most people, not yet atleast.

That could be said of any social network.
Does Facebook improve the life of anyone ? Instagram ? Twitter ? But if you want to measure up to this type of competition, user retention is really important. More people using Steemit, more people buying STEEM, the higher value it has. So user retention should be the priority for investors, and for Steemit Inc. as their role should be to maximize the returns of investors, and to maximize the value of STEEM in the long term.

Thanks for the well thought out reply. I believe there is a specific need for 15sp delegation because an account with zero money in it cannot perform any action on steemit.

I also think that providing SP to communities, while it was a good idea in concept, doesn't serve the purpose since the community needs outreach (most often only perform that within the Steemit environment rather than outside).

As far as improving lives, the other services have actually improved lives. Facebook is one of the most useful apps for communities and groups to find each other and to communicate. Instagram and Twitter have grown to become ways for people to also connect and share experiences all because of centralized ways of pushing content to users based on their commonly viewed interest. Both Twitter and Instagram use an influencer model and have become marketing tools.

Steemit can become that and more, but right now, people don't come here for anything than to make a buck from posting random stuff. And the content quality is so poor due to the crowd it attracts, that it makes the website look like a joke.

But I don't think any of that matters because the potential for the platform to grow is there. The tools to support third party growth is largely there and being developed further. Steemit will always be a condenser that shows everything on the blockchain from any user. Thats its purpose. We need to build our own communities.

For the 15 SP delegation, of course you can not set it to 0 as it's the Steem Power that gives you the bandwidth necessary to perform actions as you said. But 15 can be reduced, and multiplied by 900 000 accounts that has it, that begins to amount to something, even if you just reduce it by 5.

For the communities not reaching outside of the Steemit environment, that's totally true. But maybe the fact that communities could more easily receive massive delegations from Steemit Inc. could incentize developers to make apps that reach outside the narrow Steemit area. But developing projects (and putting time in it), with no guarantee it will attract users (in fact, the only guarantee you have is to be almost certain to have lost a lot of time). With a delegation from Steemit, you have a chance to attract people, to "pay" developers with upvotes, etc.

For improving lives, OK they improved life but it's the social networking in general that allowed that. The free masons (joke but true) are doing it since a long time, Facebook, Twitter and Instagram didn't invent anything, and Steemit does exactly the same as it is a social network. Steem can bring much more, but for now, it is reduced mainly to Steemit. And for people coming to make a buck from sh$t posting, I think a lot of these accounts are in the statistics, as Inactive. Just try to do so, you will see you will make no money (some upvotes from people with no SP) and nobody with enough Steem Power to give a real upvote will never upvote a sh$t post.
In fact a lot of them are so skittish about using their Steem Power to upvote others than themselves - or delegating to bots - that they won't even upvote quality posts. Sorry for the rant here, but that's an impression I have in my journey (of course they are exceptions), but the fact that "whales" (orcas and dolphins included) upvote only people of their kind (or are unintentionnaly circle voting) are at least as much responsible of the poor quality content here than the third world spammers trying to make a few cents.

For your conclusion, I agree at a 100 %. Steem has so much potential, we need to take action and make it as we want.

I just saw your last post :
https://busy.org/@motoengineer/can-we-better-our-communities-on-this-blockchain

I think that's exactly the kind of mentality we need from people holding a faire amount of Steem Power, and that includes Steemit Inc.

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this is amazing. Thank you. I found this post very very interesting. I didnt think the steemit.com interface was that bad, I know trending is an issue, but really didn't think it was having such an impact on retention. Fantastic work. Excited to see more of your analysis work.

Thanks a lot for your comment and your resteem !
I must say I took example on you and Asher and tried to make an analysis up to the standard (benchmark) you defined for the #analysis section.
I'm thinking about the next subject I will analyze, but haven't decided yet.

Steemit seems to have a lot of impact on retention, but the problem is that the factors are numerous and it's hard to determine why a particular user left. Imagine someone who waited two weeks for its account validation. Finally signed up, not remembering why he signed up in the first place, he arrives on Steemit, see the interface, looks at the Trending page, makes a little comment on any post to never come back.

What made him left ? The process of account verification ? The interface ? The content he saw on Trending ? The lack of response to his comment ?

Hard to say, but comparing Steemit numbers to Busy, it's clear a better interface has the potential to retain users much better than the current one.

the sign up problem is big, as for account verification, well there is non really. There are so many factors indeed, but thats where business intelligence comes into play and what you have done here is really excellent information for steemit inc. I hope @ned sees this post.

I always thought the time it took to activate your account was due to some verification process happening. It seems I was wrong...
Why does it take a week then to validate it ? I must be missing something here. I understand that you can not delegate 15 SP to every account created (the phone number is here for that), but if there is no verification, what is a delay good for ?

I hope they see it too, but I don't really know how to "call" them.

from looking at the data it 'appears' that steemit inc block approve accounts.

In the image the bar chart shows the days in may accounts were set up. other months are similar

It clearly seems that they put in place some kind of a "queue" and then massively approve accounts once in a while (always on Thursdays and Wednesdays). Maybe the team working on that only works these days of the week :D
Thanks for the picture, I have never seen it. Is it in one of your reports or is it someone else's ? I would love to keep an eye on that.

I don't understand the goal of that. If no account is refused and no verification is done, why not instantly activate accounts ? It's kinda like shooting yourself in the foot in terms of retention.

salut tu vas bien? je me permet de te contacter vu que tu as l'air de bien gérer. Ma question je souhaite faire avec @steemauto un trail de curation mais que pour l'appli @elegance pour le moment je n'ai qu'un compte et je voudrai pas que ceux qui viennent dans mon trail votent pour autre chose que cette appli. Tu crois que c'est possible? Sinon je pense faire un autre compte avec un projet sur fundition pour aider les assocs artistiques de grenoble , à plus, porte toi bien

Salut, ça va bien et toi ?
Personnellement, je n'utilise pas du tout SteemAuto mais uniquement mes propres scripts pour ce qui est des votes automatiques (sauf pour le trail du @cercle).

Pour moi un trail : les gens vont voter exactement les mêmes choses que toi. Donc si tu les tais trail ton compte @cryptoyzzy, ils vont voter ce que tu votes sur @elegance mais aussi ce que tu votes "normalement" (hors @elegance).

Donc pour moi la solution :

  • Créer un compte qui ne votera que les posts faits via l'appli elegance,
  • Faire tourner un script (Python ou JS) qui upvotera automatiquement tous les posts postés via elegance,
  • Mettre en route le "trail" sur ce compte.

ça gaze merci, ta réponse est très claire mais j'en suis incapable lol, peut être un projet pour toi? si je paye un autre compte ça répond pas au problème? en tout cas merci de ton retour

Si tu crées un autre compte, ça règle le problème, mais tu devras voter manuellement tous les posts venant d'elegance pour que les participants au trail votent à leur tour.

nan, le cercle par exemple fonctionne fort bien sans votes manuels :)
Il suffit de mettre les FANS sur le steem auto du trail
En gros le cercle a son trail
Et ses fans sont les mêmes que ceux dans le trail, du coup, automatiquement, le cercle vote pour ses fans et bim ca enclenche les votes de ceux qui suivent la trail

Oui, mais là il s'agit de voter tous les posts qui viennent d'une application donc je sais pas si c'est possible avec steemauto.

Non, ca il faut effectivement hardcoder le bot adequat

et toi ça t'intéresserait de faire ça, je pense faire un projet sur fundition si tu veut prendre la partie automatisation, tu aurais une part des gains bien sur à définir je pense que je garderai que 5% et 5 pour fundition, je vai faire un post dessine moi un avion, tu jetteras un coup d'oeil et tu me diras à plus bon dimanche

Steemit may have a churn rate, but does Steem?

Steemit clearly HAS a churn rate :D
For Steem, I would say that someone who uses the Steem blockchain and then stops, it's a customer lost !

As for now, the main usage of the Steem blockchain is done via Steemit, I allowed myself to make the amalgam.

Pretty interesting analysis here and one that dug deeper from Paulag's post on the churn rate and this is awesome.

interesting that using certain apps will have an effect in retention maybe because of the upvote that they get from those especially Busy and Esteem which depending on followers and good-karma choosing it as a post of the day could be very high.

I have to agree with your assessment that community and niche driven delegation, moderation and curation is the way to go.

Although I read in a post somewhere that Sneak of Steemit inc can hardly care about the people that are here now because this is but an experiment before SMTs roll out. I never liked sneak and what he stands for so I might be a bit bias on my dislike of him,

BTW would you be interested to work on a Steem condenser project?

Thanks for your comment !

The upvotes the users get from Busy or eSteem must have an impact on retention, it joins the last "payout" factor. It's hard to tell, for a given user, which factor has played a role in his staying on Steem.

I never heard about Sneak (just saw he's with Steemit Inc. after researching a bit) but Steemit Inc. sure doesn't seem to care that much about Steemit. It' understandable as they see the Steem Blockchain as their product and not Steemit.
But the problem (in my opinion) is that Steem is linked to Steemit, and without Steemit, Steem may have no utility. The Steem blockchain wouldn't be used if there was no Steemit. Detaching completely Steem from Steemit might be good but it's a risk to take, it might also kill Steem and Steemit altogether.

And yes, there are already projects based on the Steem blockchain (dtube, dlive, zappl, etc.) but I'm talking about them too when I say Steemit. I'm talking more globally about the social networking apps that are based on the Steem blockchain. And I also think that the success of Dtube, DLive etc. depends greatly on their integration into Steemit.
So I think I agree with you (and disagree with Sneak).

PS : I might be interested, but I would need to hear more details about this.

Yes because the vote from those condensers can be quite substantial and can make the difference of having some votes instead of zero votes.

But the problem (in my opinion) is that Steem is linked to Steemit, and without Steemit, Steem may have no utility. The Steem blockchain wouldn't be used if there was no Steemit. Detaching completely Steem from Steemit might be good but it's a risk to take, it might also kill Steem and Steemit altogether.

I agree with you on this and it is a too big of a risk and might make Steem lose its First Mover Advantage on being a social networking app that is decentralized and have different condensers and platforms.

I hope we can discuss further the projects I have in mind that is more based on community initiatives. You can contact me through discord maverickinvictus#9479

I agree with you on this and it is a too big of a risk and might make Steem lose its First Mover Advantage on being a social networking app that is decentralized and have different condensers and platforms.

Couldn't have said it better !

I added and contacted you on Discord, looking forward to exchange some ideas !

salut, merci pour ce post instructif, j'avais remarqué que tous les acteurs crypto d'autres réseaux sociaux n'étaient pas très présents ou peu suivi comme @journalducoin @hascheur @cryptogains qui sont très suivis ailleurs. Je vois ça perso comme un changement positif dans le sens ou steemit est maintenant utilisé par des personnes par forcément sensible à la techno blockchain. Ce qui peut faire penser pour du long terme à un nouveau mode d'utilisation et à un avenir certain pour steemit

Merci pour tes encouragements.

Effectivement, pour moi aussi, c'est plutôt un signal positif que le taux de rétention sur les sujets crypto soit faible alors qu'il est beaucoup plus élevé sur des sujets plus généraux. Ce qui prouve bien que Steem devient un réel concurrent pour les réseaux sociaux traditionnels.

Le seul problème (et c'est ce que j'évoque dans le post), c'est que l'attrition reste très forte, pour plusieurs raisons. Mais principalement (à mon avis) car le public avisé (qui est là pour la technologie blockchain) accorde peu d'importance à l'expérience utilisateur et au design, alors que le public "traditionnel" qui vient juste pour utiliser Steem comme un réseau social classique, lui, est très sensible à l'expérience utlisateur. Il ne sait pas comment accorder des autorisations via SteemConnect, l'interface de Steemit lui paraît vraiment pauvre et peu ergonomique (j'essaie de me mettre à leur place).

Et à ce niveau-là, Steem ne fait pas du tout le poids (notamment l'app Steemit, Busy est bien meilleure) face aux acteurs traditionnels du marché (facebook, twitter, instagram, reddit, etc...)

merci de me forcer à prendre le dico pour te comprendre, lol (attrition). Busy est bien plus fonctionnel, c'est sur, et d'ailleurs j'en fais la promotion sur différents réseaux, mais sans grand retour pour le moment (d'ailleurs y'a t'il un moyen de suivre le nombre de personnes qui se sont inscrites avec le lien affilié busy? un ami l'a fait et s'est retrouvé sur steemit directement). En tant que nouvel utilisateur ce qui peut être déroutant c'est le nombre d'appli, @dtube @dlive @elegance @dsound et celles que je ne connais pas. Toutes ont leur intérêt mais ça peut être perturbant.
As tu une stat ou on peut voir le nombre d'utilisateurs actif à ce jour? à plus

Je ne connais pas trop le principe du lien d'affiliation Busy donc je ne peux pas t'aider pour ça.

La diversité des apps est bonne pour Steem, mais comme tu le dis c'est le manque d'informations qui est pénalisant pour les utilisateurs et qui peut vite devenir décourageant.

Si tu veux des stats plus générales sur Steem, je te conseille de suivre @penguinpablo qui fait un rapport quotidien (voir le dernier). Mais en gros, on est à 60 000 utilisateurs actifs quotidiens (ça peut être des gens qui votent ou font des transferts uniquement, ce chiffre ne prend pas uniquement les gens qui postent).

ok merci pour l'info et continu à nous informer, tu as au moins un client, lol

60 000 ?
C'est pas foufou

Merci

C'est clair que c'est pas foufou, et puis aucun chiffre concernant tous les comptes en automatique (que ce soit les votants qui ne viennent plus mais n'ont jamais désactivé leur SteemAuto, les bots, les délégateurs des bid-bots / upvote-bots qui reçoivent leurs paiements, et j'en passe). Là 60 000 c'est vraiment en moyenne, le nombre d'utilisateurs uniques qui sont impliqués dans une transaction qui passe par la blockchain Steem.

Bon après il y a aussi tous les gens qui se contentent de consulter les posts (ou qui n'ont pas du tout de compte Steem) qui ne sont pas pris en compte. Donc ça compense, peut-être, ou pas.

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