A few days ago I did a post about how I prepared for Chinese New Year in Taiwan. It got quite a lot of engagement from real human beings and I was very fortunate that people liked it and upvoted it. And before I start my rant, today is Chinese New Year, let me wish you all a very happy year of the rat!
Anyway, back to my post. The next day, I got hit with a big downvote which wiped 10% off my post payout. I get downvotes all the time because there are a lot of parasites on Steemit and I've learnt to live with it. This one was from a lot bigger account and it was totally uncalled for as mine wasn't a shit post.
Some say you should try speaking to that person if you encounter these problems, to see if there's any misunderstanding. I left a polite comment on one of his/her post
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Today, he/she came back with a response, and another 50% downvote on my latest post. Apparently, I am guilty of having 100% downvote power. That's it. Not because I shit post, not because I used bid bots, not because I circle jerk, not because I don't engage and not because I don't upvote other people's post. Just because I have 100% unused downvote power, and I don't downvote people.
I am told as a stakeholder I have a responsibility to use my downvote power, and it seems that if I don't I get punished. Period.
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This is the most fucked up thing I have ever heard on Steemit. A stakeholder responsibility on Steemit is contributing to make this a better place and support the growth of Steemit and Steem. Ok, that's me saying this, but tell me if it's wrong. Stakeholder responsibilities can take different forms. Not being an arsehole is one. Onboarding new users and supporting others count. Having faith in Steem, powering up and not post, cash out and run is another. Downvoting, for the right reason, is also being a responsible stakeholder. But not doing all of these does not make me an irresponsible stakeholder.
A year ago I would have been totally pissed off at losing so much payout from my post. I'm not saying I don't mind now, but as someone said on Discord today, it's not ours till payout, so yeah, I'm annoyed, but I'm not going to lose any sleep over it.
What really annoys me is being punished for not doing something, and then only to be told of the stupid twisted logic when asked. Since when did Steemit become a kindergarten?
I found this via @creativeblue and I think it's disgusting what these trolls are doing.
They like to paint themselves as 'good actors' but are in fact 'bad actors'.
I fail to see how upvote bots are worse that downvote bots; it's hypocrisy.
They are the enemy of Steem's mission of mass adoption.
"I fail to see how upvote bots are worse that downvote bots;"< -- THIS.I said that on day one after the fork when the 'downvote without judging the content but just because they got an upvote from something they paid for" was only a murmur, but that murmur sure gained STEEM fast.. -- but you know what they say, sheep are quick to flock, and sheep are very dumb.. I pity this world.
Honestly, downvoting blindly is more of an abuse of the blockchain especially because generally an abusive shitpost gets found out, but it's rare that a punished decent post gets rescued.
Anywas, people are trying to boycott @likwid over this and on that front I just want to say in this case I am taking the stance that people can separate themselves from their business, especially when their business is not meant to represent them at all - in this case the business is a bot. Let's not grasp at straws here people. If something provides you with a service you enjoy, and it's completely removed from the enemy, I don't see any harm or fowl continuing to use a service you enjoy. Just saying.
It's like downvoting @likwid's posts just because they associated with a bidbot, but their posts were contributing positively to the blockchain (as does @likwid's service)..
Thank you. I need my downvote power for when there are genuinely bad actors.
People shouldn't be punished by bots for having their downvote power at 100%. Crazy stuff.
I disagree with the whole premise that it's a "bad act" to downvote/flag. If you are standing by and watching a woman get beat.... don't you deserve to be beaten yourself for it? When you could have helped the woman, but didn't? In my personal opinion, indifference is just as bad as abuse. You have been given a personal ability to choose to combat/counter rewards where you see fit, and you just sit on your ass with it. Obviously it's not a requirement to do so, just like it isn't a requirement to help the woman who's being beat. The question is, are you really as self-righteous as you make yourself out to be, because you don't flag people? Also, do you have such little faith/wavering faith, that you actually believe flags will drive people away? I politely disagree with that narrative as well. I got flagged almost instantly after I joined. **I reached out to the community here. I got help. People cared. Actually, @berniesanders, of all people, was the one to help assist me when I was flagged for no reason other than someone was having a bad day and decided to flag anyone who interacted with bernie.
I think the real issue is that people complain too fucking much about what other people do with their stake. If you don't like it, there's a door, but this is ultimately what we sign up for the moment we create an account and whether the flags have been free or not, they've always been around and people have always seemingly used them in nonsensical and malicious ways.
What are you even basing your accusation on anyways @crypto.piotr? How do you even know people are leaving steem in any measurable amount? Account activity? Because I'm sure a LOT of that is down now that bots have been countered more successfully than ever before. If that's what you're basing it on, then you're extremely misguided. I, myself, joined this place within the last 230~ days. Considering it's been around much longer than I'd ever realized, I am "new" here and there continue to be new, real users. The bots dying off is why there is so much less activity, it's not because people are "leaving" this place. I find it funny how everyone who "leaves" seems to come back inevitably. As much as people run their mouths about how terrible this place is, they seem to stick around like glue. Smh.
That is a shit analogy. We are not talking people beating someone, we are talking about assholes downvoting for arbitrary reasons and forcing people to use an option they decided to opt out of. A voluntary option to downvote, when the users feels it is needed. Not a forced downvoting quota. This downvote fascists need to stay on gab or the ghosts of 8chan.
If I were to start being flagged on my posts, over not using my flagging power, I'd start to use it on things I disagreed with. Not a complicated concept and sure, you shouldn't "have to" but neither should other people "have to" not flag you, either. Complaining about other people's blockchain RIGHTS, gets us nowhere. It is simply a cry of anger and emotion and it doesn't help at all. The post talks about "kindergarten" but children ARE the ones who bitch and cry when shit doesn't go their way. Those are the facts and that is what's happening here. You were given a simple choice, use your flagging power to fight some abuse, or be flagged yourself. You CHOSE the latter, it was not forced upon you. You were given a choice. People just don't seem to like the consequences of their CHOICES. It's sad. Grow the fuck up. Complaining about free money in the first place makes you look stupid. Smfh.
It's not their choice when they are forced to choose only the options forced upon them by someone who isnt in a place to set rules. That isnt choice. This isn't "Free Money", people invest their time and finances into this platform. You are literally complaining about someone's RIGHT to complain on their blog on a blockchain... Grow the fuck up.
Maybe you're just more 8chan drainage the way you think.
Says someone with no obvious intelligence. That's rich.
Nothing in life is a choice, by that dumb ass logic. Smh.
We didn't choose to be here, but we choose to stay (or not). We don't choose to have to work, it is forced upon us. Those are not choices, those are situations. Same as this. It is a situation, with choices. Just because they aren't the choices you WANT does not mean they are not choices. I used the perfect analogy, because it's exactly the same thing. Someone using their power in a way they have a right to. They have a right to flag if they feel that it's damaging for people to not flag when they're given free flags. To make the point that we aren't choosing to be forced to make the decision, is irrelevant. Choices are still there, no choices were removed, only options. The same as anything else in life. It sounds like you're a crying little bitch. You're the one who definitely needs to grow up. Fucking pathetic.
Lol..nice come back..what ya got next? I'm rubber and you're glue? Then some more of your bullshit circular logic and a dash of name calling? Grow the fuck up. Maybe Steem is too much for you to handle like a grown up. LMFAO Forcing one to use an option when the didn't want to is not allowing them the choice. What a fucking snowflake. Melt much?
Haha. What a fucking bitch. You're pathetic. Your low IQ attempts to insult me were just pathetic. Like your life. Circular logic. lol. Coming from your stupid ass. That's rich. Steem is fine for me. :) I share things I like.
Seems the snowflake here is you, not I. YOU are the one crying like a little bitch because someone chose an option available to them and it happened to inconvenience someone else slightly, so they cried about it like a little bitch, and you're continuing on, BITCHING like a little bitch, about it. Talk about circular, your logic means you are a little bitch, since you're bitching about someone using their power how they saw fit. Cry some more, pathetic fucking baby. lol. :)
Also: Now that I have spoken on this topic, and do not use my flag power, I fully expect someone to exercise their blockchain right to flag my posts until I start to use it. Guess who WON'T be bitching about it tho. ;)
Also @crypto.piotr is who led me here by spamming people's wallets with shitty links (Annoying and shitty behavior. Might warrant some use of my flag power. Hmm..)
I just posted my own publication about your case @livinguktaiwan
You may like to check it out:
https://steemit.com/hive-175254/@crypto.piotr/enough-is-enough-let-s-all-step-back-and-figure-out-what-can-be-done-to-stop-losing-steem-users
Yours,
Piotr
Yes, I agree use of downvotes to force opinions on others is super wrong. I was not a fan of the last hardfork, and now downvotes are doing exactly what I thought they would do to quality posts. They are reducing their rewards and visibility. People are becoming blacklisted as well, with challenging/unfair hurdles set by the blacklister to be removed.
I am 100% guilty of not downvoting often too. When I downvote, I always comment why, and I always offer to compromise or change the downvote if the author is being considerate and honest. There is no rule that each account holder has to police and downvote daily. To enforce a made up rule for manditory slave labor and conformity is an abuse of power.
I can tell engagement with comments has great value to your posts, so I think that posts like this should be encouraged. Rewards from posts like this are benefitting small curators, which is hugely important to our steem ecosystem to grow strong and healthy.
I tend to write a comment why that post/behaviour might lead to down votes. Often these Steemians didn't know that what they were doing was wrong or not accepted. Always better trying that first before flagging without telling why.
Totally agree with you, Steemit can be daunting even for those who have been around for a while and many still make mistakes or aren't aware that what they say may be in appropriate.
I wanted to downvote a bad story, did not downvote, but told the author it's downvote worthy... I am also afraid of downvoting other's post, they might take revenge and downvote you back anyway... that's not cool...yawns...who knows some whale downvotes my quality post tommorow): , insecure...
Please don't say this @creativetruth, no one should be guilty of not downvoting enough or not downvoting at all - that was exactly what I was "accused" of. You should only downvote when you feel a post justifies it, and if there is none then that's fine. It's actually good because that means Steemit is healthy.
I certainly agree with your comment about engagement, and that I do admit being guilty of not doing enough. Throwing a post out on the blockchain and collecting the rewards 7 days later is of course financially nice, but it does little to grow the community if there is no engagement when everyone is sitting in silo.
!engage 30
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Dear @livinguktaiwan
Happy Chinese New Year to you :)
I've read recent post by @likwid a moment ago and I've noticed your conversation with user behind this project.
It's obvious that you were very polite and received response ... I would consider being simply rude.
Funny enough - I was actually considering using likwid services, but they have lost my interest and I think there is no space on steem blockchain for users with their attitude.
ps. I just upvoted your post with my account and @project.hope (around 300k sp) to show my little support. Don't let pepople like @transisto bring you down and discourage you from being active on STEEM blockchain. We've lost enough users already because of downvote abuse and I hope we won't lose another one.
Yours, Piotr
I went to that likwid link you posted and I was like why your brought me to this page that is giving attractive service to liquify Steem and stuff... until I saw your comments there that showed you don't recomment that service because of the actions of likwid...
but that service looked attractive but who is to say I can rely on someone to do that job giving them beneficiary benefit of 100% , amounts to centralisation and we crypto enthusiasts are against centralisation.
So stupid that people misuse their downvoting power, I wanted to downvote a person
s story coz it was awful... but I did not want to discourage with downvote, although I get downvotes on nice posts I do all the time...
I think this downvite stuff should be removed...not fun, it's used as we know just like that, not responsible. it's stupid for sure.
Downvotes do have their place here, and if used correctly can be for the benefit of the platform. Sadly, there are always some who abuses the power given to them
Thank you for your support @cyrpto.piotr, I would have been very upset a year ago to be bullied like this, but I've seen more and more of these type behaviour around recently to not get upset now. I've gone past my initial anger and annoyance stage and am not letting this affect me. I'm going to be hanging around, so don't worry!!
Hey @livinguktaiwan
I saw this post because of a "memo spam" msg from @creativeblue... I put that in inverted commas because this is the first time I've received such a memo and actually clicked the link... and then your post moved me enough to actually warrant a comment... So before I start MY rant, shoutout to both of you... good job! \m/
I heard about @likwid some time back and thought it was a great idea... made a mental note of it, because I can see myself using such a service in the future. However, the person behind it is obviously an asshole, and as such won't ever use it purely out of principle now.
Sorry to hear about your experience, the only advice I can offer is that you should simply ignore it, and move along. The community will hopefully react in the same manner as they did to another clown, @transisto, and his @sadkitten account. STEEM(it) has many good whales, but unfortunately it's also full of entitled idiots that got lucky by getting into STEEM early, amassed a large stake, and now have an unwarranted god complex. Fortunately/hopefully the community will react to these fools and they'll simply fade away.
Once again, sorry to hear about your run-in with the kindergarten posse... Fuck them!
Just @transisto being random again.
Being "random"? That is not being random. That is choosing a shit reason to downvote people and acting on it.
It’s amongst the weird things he does. So, I’ve conceded to random. Lol
"Weird" is a nice way of saying "being a jerk".
Dear @braaiboy
I actually had very similar impression. I just heard about @likwid several days ago and I was considering using it's service. But I don't think I will ever do that.
ps. I've noticed that you didn't post anything in 3 weeks. Hope you didn't give up on Steemit yourself.
Cheers, Piotr
Hey @crypto.piotr,
Nope... haven't given up at all... Dec & Jan are traditionally just slow months (business and video-making wise), so I don't have too much to post about and share... but will def. be back at it again from Feb.
Hi @braaiboy
Thanks for prompt reply.
I've noticed that you resteemed @taverngames post lately. Did you try out this game for yourself?
Also would it be okey if I take few minutes of your time and tell you little bit about curation trail I'm working currently with few other guys from @project.hope? Perhaps our efforts would be something you would like to support.
Is there any way I could DM you? Via discord or telegram?
Cheers,
Piotr
Hi again @braaiboy
Can I ask you for little favour? I joined contest called "Community of the week" with project I manage and I would be grateful if you could RESTEEM it and help me get some exposure and drop some encouraging comment :)
Link to my post: on steemit or on steempeak
Thanks :)
Yours, Piotr
Ha... wealthy and mighty whales!!!
Thanks for your comment @braaiboy, I really appreciate it. Luckily it seems like the good whales outnumber the bad ones otherwise this place would be a nightmare and we'd all be walked over and abused by the bad guys who think they can do as they please.
I'm hoping this will all pass over very soon, thanks again!
!engage 30
@braaiboy you have received
30 ENGAGEfrom @livinguktaiwan!View and trade the tokens on Steem Engine.
I think I've down voted maybe 3 posts in 4 years. I tend to down vote blatant spam or people seriously abusing the system. Just let it go. It's their karma not yours. Just keep doing you, most times those people are just looking for a reaction. If you feel something is worthy of a down vote, then by all means it's your right. Don't feel obligated though if it's not in your personality.
Happy New Year!
Same here, I've probably downvoted a handful of times since I've been here. There are a lot of shit posts around but my downvote won't make any difference to them, so there are just things you learn to live with, even though it's not ideal.
Thanks for dropping by.
!engage 20
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Wow, this is incredibly stupid. Thanks for sharing. There's probably something to learn about here for everyone, @likwid included. Thanks to @creativeblue letting @logiczombie now via "spam memo" ;) When I visited your blog today I went there out of curiosity. Good thing! Let's give some kudos here... @tipu curate
Upvoted 👌 (Mana: 0/3 - need recharge?)
Hi @livinguktaiwan, a modest tip of appreciation:
$trendotoken and !trendovoter .
Also, please check out my Second Nonsense Writing Contest.
Thanks!
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You should follow the downvote trail @steemflagrewards runs?
Then you are being responsible while not having to give more than oversight on what you downvote.
If you don't think the post is abusive all you got to do is speak up.
If everybody did this the price might recover a little.
I Leaved This Platform For These Motherfuckers. They Do Downvotes Without any reasons.
Wow, It's very surprising and a complete misunderstanding for my part. It's really a shame to see how Steemit is advancing and evolving in downvotes and it's nonsense. The most shame is when we newbies have paid the price for nothing it's sad instead of just explaining.
Don't worry @misschance, Steemit is not as bad as it sounds, I guess I was just unlucky. At least I am glad I can take the hit (unless he takes his craziness to another level) so rather me than newbies. Don't get demotivated by all this nonense.
Yes, I hope not to be targeted and I do not demotivate myself Steemit is the future :)
The problem of that logic is it may likely trigger more downvote and retaliatory wars causing far more damage in the longer run, what a way to promote Steem to new comers.
Exactly. Downvoting just to be seen doing it, that's the most stupid thing I saw an Steem. And there are a lot... well... we all know what I mean ;)
That's one of the reason I stay away from the downvote war if possible. Everyone has a role here and I think one should do what is most effective and works for themselve, to make Steem a better place for everyone.
if you're getting harassed by downvoters, set your rewards to "declined" so they don't hurt your rep (but you still get rep from upvotes!!) and then when you're safely above a rep of 26+, all the newb robot downvotes won't affect you.
Right, setting your default rewards to "declined" will keep the 60's and 70's from killing your rep.
Downvotes from people with lower rep than you won't hurt your rep.
Thanks, for the info. I've modified my sig - "setting your rewards to "declined" doesn't seem to protect you from loss of rep, although it does dissuade steemcleaners and steemflagrewards"
@freezepeach please consider reviewing this case for @starworld
@steemflagrewards please consider reviewing this case for @starworld
Happy Chinese New Year.
That downvote was uncalled for. They are supposed to be meant for spam, hate speech, and the like aren't they? Not simply because someone disagrees with you. I'm as mad as you are.
Well... A downvote simply means "I don't think you should get rewards". Why you think that - you have to decide.
Thanks @proto26, I'm passed the mad stage now, just have to accept there are idiots in this world, in real life and in the virtual world.
Thanks for dropping by, appreciate it
Kindergarten... Well, I started in August 18 and have to say: "terrible two" tantrums are a special of quite some high rollers ;)
That’s definitely annoying! I am getting more downvotes too but don’t know why! Happy New Year 🥳
A lot of those downvotes don't have any impact at all, they're just a pain in the butt and have nothing better to do than to waste space and RC, so I wouldn't be too worried ^_^
Annoying yes but some of the oldest users are some of the worst people here. Due to building up a lot of stake over the past few years they think that they can do what they like. Ignore it and keep doing what your doing.
Over time a lot of these larger accounts power down and with a greater distribution of STEEM the voting is going to be a lot more balanced.
Congratulations @rycharde, 5.13% upvote has been shared with your successful call on the post that shared by @livinguktaiwan!
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Happy CNY and take care~
Thanks, hope all is well in HK
Damn bro that really sucks. Don't let it get you down. Keep supporting quality people on Steemit and everything will be alright.
Thanks a lot for your comment. Definitely will continue to do what I can to support people on Steemit.
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Hi @livinguktaiwan!
Your post was upvoted by @steem-ua, new Steem dApp, using UserAuthority for algorithmic post curation!
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That's awful @livinguktaiwan
I absolutely disagree with this reason. Upvoted and resteemed
Thank you for your support on this issue @project.hope. I really appreciate you helping to raise awareness
Beberapa kali postingan saya juga di downvote.
Saya pikir mereka hanya iseng, tetapi perilakunya merugikan banyak orang
Oh yes... and have some !BEER & !trdo tokens too ;-)
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You got a 7.63% upvote worth $0.004 from @upvotewhale courtesy of @creativeblue!
Wow, that is really messed up! Definitely not going to be using their services...
I fully agree with you @bengy. It's such a mess up reply :/
Thank you for bringing this to my attention @livinguktaiwan. Apparently some of my rented voting power on Minnow Support was used to upvote their post, unaware to me. For @transisto and @likwid to abuse the beneficiary reward features for personal gain is - while not surprising - a dangerously abusive stance to take for the future of Steem.
Even more atrocious yet, is to take the stance that down voting at random (including plenty of quality content) is a stakeholder's responsibility. That is skewed at best. You may be able to argue that down voting inappropriate content is warranted and even necessary, but to indiscriminately abuse your Steem Power is tyrannical.
For what it is worth, his post received a 100% down vote from me just now. I encourage others, whales to minnows, to also take action. This platform doesn't belong to tyrannical whales, and if it does, then I will no longer support it.
The problem is that deep down at the roots is a good idea: we have free downvotes and they are there to be used. But every Steemian has to decide for themselves whether they use it and when.
Totally agree, and how one uses their voting power is their own business, they should not be dictated by someone else
That is the bottom line.
Thanks @tunnelrat, I really appreciate your response.
Downvote does have it's place here as Steemit is far from perfect as we all know, with all the shit post and abuse going on. Ultimately its up to the community to come together and make this a better place and to for Steem to grow. I'm somewhat overwhelmed by the response here and am grateful to know that there are still so many people who care about Steemit despite the Steem price.
Agreed. Systems will always be abused, which is why they need to be improved. Thanks for bringing up this topic, it takes more guts the more you have invested.
Thanks for sharing! Sorry that this happened to you. It is one of the most absurd excuse or reasoning I've ever seen.
Thanks @wittywheat. It's beggars belief some of the things people do here. I'm sure we'll see even more absurd things in the future, but hopefully it won't deter any of us.
I am very sorry @livinguktaiwan , I hope that account does not downvote your post ever again. I am feeling scared now, like now actually): ...not correct to downvote post if its not a bad post you know. It's completely unfair!!
Anyway ... good day
Thanks for your comment @mintymile. Please don't worry, bad things come and go, just hang in there.
By the way, I noticed you posted a few interesting travel posts recently. I curate for the @steemitworldmap, if you're not aware of us, please check out the account and how to pin your post on the Steemitworldmap. My work there is one of the things that keep me motivated on Steemit and to help worthy quality authors
https://steemitworldmap.com/
Thanks, @livinguktaiwan, I love your attitude. Thanks for giving me the @steemitworldmap details as well!!
Things will be seen, I have seen that you flageed when you are wrong, and it takes away all the rewards and not only the benefit of that mistake, which in my case was for using a label that I should not. I was penalized all the reward and even that of other people.
We all get downvotes and you earn well. How come you only care now it takes 10% of your earnings and not if the little fish loose that and not even receive a payout or lose their rep within two days time?
Welcome in the world of Steem.
Posted using Partiko Android
How did you know I didn't care before? Because I didn't write a post every time a little fish got downvoted?
If you read my post properly, my issue isn't about payout. People can upvote, downvote , remove or change their vote as they see fit, I have no control over that. My issue is people throwing their weight around, telling me what to do with my VP. That's none of their business. Even my mum doesn't get to tell me what to do and don't punish me when I dont listen to her.
This is completely ridiculous @livinguktaiwan. I can't remember who called me over here, but I do have to concur with everyone who says it's your right to exercise your (down) vote. Or not. I get downvoted by (happily) fleas. So, it makes little if any impact. I did have a few massive downvotes and then I cashed in my SBI and that stopped. It raises another set of questions, though, doesn't it?
And, your question -
It's not Steemit, so much, but the children who play on the platform. IMO.
Thanks for dropping by @fionafavourites, really appreciate it.
I don't think anyone is immune to those annoying little fleas, just need to ignore them. A sad fact but a reality in this virtual world. And I heard about the SBI issue, it's a pity that innocent users like yourself was dragged into it. I'm glad it's stopped now, though probably not in the way you wanted it to.
Thanks and take care!
No, nobody is immune and I've grown a hide ignoring them. Yes, I think the SBI issue is sad because the people most intended to benefit have been the collateral damage.
And you take care, too!
Point taken
This seems to be the mentality of the whales around here. Which leads to the question:
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That happens to me as well. The same reason: not downvoting others while I never bought votes or used bid-bots, but still getting downvotes on almost all my posts. The worst part was when I was downvoted with a big % which also cut a big part of my payout ..but then I thought about asking nicely for a reason, but never got a reply, just another 5 accounts of the same person who downvoted my post again. and again, and again..
Oh! Has this stopped now?
Steemit has always been a kindergarden. Flag him back. Maybe then he'll remove his flags.
Strange but true.
It has happened to me today, went through the comments and stumbled across this link. It is beginning to make more sense as to why... sadly. Can we report this type of activity?
Sounds like misinformation. You must have done something questionable to get downvoted by any of those accounts.
Doubt it. But okay.
Thank you for voicing out your opinions @creativeblue. I'm not sure they can be reasoned with at all, some people just can't be helped, but I really appreciate it. Thanks once again for trying to make Steemit a better place so we don't lose more users