58fca202ac7c2faeb4e24b55b87072e8fe9a264f
Proposal Payment
https://hiveblocks.com/tx/58fca202ac7c2faeb4e24b55b87072e8fe9a264f
Proposal
This proposal is for the SPS.DAO account to stake an additional 28,000,000 SPS for a total of 30,000,000 staked.
Purpose
The SPS.DAO should start capturing a higher percentage of SPS staking yield in order to be in a better financial position to support the goals of the ecosystem going forward. Many of the SPS rewards pools are time limited, and once they run out, the SPS DAO will need to be self-sustaining to fund rewards into the future.
Additional proposals can and likely will be made for how to deploy the new staking funds captured by the DAO. While there are some ideas for illustrative purposes below, they may require more discussion and risk diluting this proposal and so are NOT included in the scope of this proposal.
Current State and Desired Outcome
According to SPLEX (https://splex.gg/user/@sps.dao), the SPS.DAO account has 58,093,490 SPS at the time of this writing and only 2,000,000 of it is staked.
The Splintercards Staking calculator shows that a 30,000,000 SPS stake would yield a ~50% APR and ~$1,000 a day. This $1,000 a day represents missed opportunity that the DAO could be capturing to control SPS and Voucher Inflation and help ensure that the SPS.DAO has as many funds as possible to help sustain the economy going forward.
Potential Reasons to Support
There are many opportunities for utilizing the additional revenue but the scope of this proposal is for the SPS.DAO to stake these funds and start capturing the revenue as quickly as possible.
Some of those additional ideas are relevant to the proposal to only stake 28,000,000 additional SPS instead of the entire amount on hand.
If the DAO were to sell the 17,000 GLX a day at $0.03 per GLX and use those proceeds to buy DEC at $0.0006 that represents 850,000 DEC per day that the DAO could acquire to hold or use for LPs. There are just over 300 days remaining in the GLX Airdrop for SPS stakers and so time is of the essence for the DAO to capture as much as 250,000,000 DEC. 250 mil DEC would need approximately 6 mil SPS for the DEC:SPS LP at current prices (and more if DEC goes up without a corresponding rise in SPS prices).
Leaving approximately 28,000,000 SPS unstaked leaves flexibility for the SPS.DAO to fund liquidity pools or other future expenses while making an attempt to take advantage of earning opportunities (most especially the GLX airdrop) that will not be here forever.
Potential Reasons to Oppose
The largest reason not to vote for this proposal would likely be because the SPS.DAO would begin receiving approximately 6.3% of all SPS Staking Yield once the custodians execute this proposal. Current SPS stakers would see their yield go down by this amount.
Conclusion
To the extent that we have staked SPS, the Splinterlands community are all stakeholders in the SPS DAO and we will all be dependent upon the DAO to sustain rewards after the initial rewards period laid out in the whitepaper.
This proposal represents a strong first step towards maximizing the SPS DAO funds to for the good of the community.
Thank you in advance for your support and any thoughtful commentary on ways we can improve this proposal as a community.
edit: updated 11:15 CT on 1/12/2023 to add a description to the post "The SPS.DAO should start capturing a higher percentage of SPS staking yield to fund future goals for the community."
This proposal is conflicting for me and i'm not 'sold on' that this is the way. The arguments are not convincing and the more it is explained = the more confused i get.
All i see with this proposal, is 6.3% THEFT (180k SPS plus) of 'My Voice' each year!
Questions: Proposals with tough opposition to what we want, will come. I'm thinking all things BOTS i.e. Should they be allowed to play in tournaments / brawls.
1) Will the DAO vote on these, and will it vote the same way you would?
2) If this proposal passes, Will you keep your SPS powered up or will you look elsewhere for higher returns? (is the real plan of the proposal just to shake us out? 🤔)
Staked SPS hodlers / voters have already got the raw end of the deal - we all shuda sold ages ago 😂
Gunna vote... NO.
Wishing you all an exceptional 2023
This is the kind of stuff I expected to see once the proposal system was opened up. And judging by some of the comments, votes are made based on popularity, which is dangerous, as plenty of popular people have dumb ideas. And here we have a vote for people to voluntarily reduce their own influence. Amazing.
The DAO can't vote on proposals as the proposals are there to decide what the DAO decides on. It has to agree with the majority decision from the voting stage.
This "inert" staked SPS may also have to be considered for the minimum required votes to pass value.
Yeah, they said the same thing about the Steemit INC. stake and look at what happened.
One consideration I can see for this... How is the @sps.dao Staked SPS handled in terms of calculating the total Staked SPS for a quorum vote of Proposals and Preprosals?
Moving from 2mil to 30mil would add an additional 1.4mil required minimum Staked SPS vote to reach quorum (5% of total Staked SPS).
I think this is easily dealt with by subtracting the SPS.DAO staked SPS from the "total Staked SPS" number used to calculate quorum... since SPS.DAO is not a voter... but the holder and implementer of the votes.
Otherwise, this makes sense to me :)
Since the Dao has full control over SPS, is such a proposal really needed?
Couldn't the Dao issue more SPS or create additional funding sources? And if that is the case, isn't this essentially just a proposal to decrease stake rewards for existing SPS stakers?
If the Dao did not have power over SPS, then I might be more amenable to the Dao wanting to acquire more funds but since the Dao could just pass other proposals to deal with funding or SPS, I'm not sure if this proposal is really that useful (unless the purpose is to reduce staked SPS rewards).
I certainly hope not. If so, we are doomed to fail. I think some people think that could happen, but not according to the whitepaper. If this ever changes then I will sell whatever I have left and leave at that time. In other words, this is something I have 100% counted on since the beginning and changing would make any cap worthless. Changing this would be worse than making 2 million brand new Alpha packs (which of course would be horrible too).
From the very beginning of the whitepaper:
The maximum total supply of SPS tokens will not exceed 3,000,000,000 which are planned to be allocated as follows:
um, first glance answer would be no.
won't this just screw up the proposal voting system?
Think i seen this in chat - Splinterlands to rent out SPS (at a % rate) to those that need it or take the risker trade and put into multiple pools, not compete directly with players /me on Voting Power ROI.
Id like not to feel pressure that i have to take a risker bet cause the ROI isn't high enough in staking. DAO i feel, has more options
Disclaimer: No SPS in pools all in staked SPS. i also have 7 days to change my mind on this, will wait to cast vote :)
I think ideally the players are staking SPS for player staking, tournaments, governance and other reasons to stake as opposed to purely yield.
Players are inherently able to move faster than a DAO in their positioning for yield, so I would argue that the DAO has a fiduciary responsibility to do relatively safe investments or only those investments that will specifically benefit the ecosystem (preferably both).
The DAO should be excluded from proposal voting - it already has 2 mil staked SPS that doesn't seem to be screwing anything up. But worst case, the DAO staking more SPS requires more engagement and voting for a proposal to carry. I see that as a positive and not a negative.
i see the DAO as a Bank. I love banks but if my bank competed with me directly in my field, id tell them to fk off! they make $ through me from loans. Banks can't move as quick but also have longer time frames / more choices etc.
SPS is for voting! We are gunna have to battle ideas we believe in such as do we think your proposal is worth while / should bots compete in tournaments etc.
You wanna put pressure on me to take my 3 million stake elsewhere. I'm not for it. In fact thinking about it, i might buy more SPS just so your proposal doesn't pass! hahaha
edit: Right now i feel i can have my cake and can eat it too. find another way.
Tend to agree. The DAO was "balanced" by the initial distribution of SPS as per the White Paper. To give it more "stake" compared to the community that sees staking rewards as "for them"; not "for the DAO" seems like a haircut, and a decline in potential rewards for those that HODL and accumulate more SPS.
Pretty sure I heard that the SPS DAO had yet to receive it's rewards from the Whitepaper but that is really a separate discussion.
The DAO (imo) needs to start earning yield on its capital. It will need this to be sustainable in the longer term. By definition, we as SPS stakers are owners of the DAO right down to voting proportionately based on our SPS stake what the DAO does with its funds.
I posted a much longer reply to this under davemccoys replys to MichealB but essentially, the DAO soaking up some of this inflation during the period of high inflation goes a long way towards reducing the liquid supply of SPS and thus, if demand remains constant, raising the price of SPS.
Otherwise we're looking at SPS with a market cap of around $25,000,000 right now and our 'numerator' of the liquid SPS out there is growing by 30,000,000 a month. That's roughly 3% more liquid SPS a month at current rates. That means that all else being equal, SPS will go down 3% a month.
We definitely need to solve the demand problem, but the SPS DAO soaking up these funds takes them off the market, reduces the inflation by saving the funds for later when the community really needs them and will help in the short term by stemming some of the issues with the fact that the current distribution of SPS far outstrips the demand for it.
So - out of curiosity - what would your plan be for the DAO funding rewards when that time comes?
The intent of this proposal is for the DAO to accumulate as many funds as it can during this period where the whitepaper is funding the rewards. To me, it's especially important in the short term because of the GLX opportunity, but I also think that the DAO will be required / motivated to start supplementing rewards as soon as 3 years from now.
So - if you do not want the DAO to take advantage of this period to accumulate as much capital as possible so that we can (ideally) fund rewards off of the interest of our future investments, what would your alternative strategy be?
i don't have the answers except to maybe start building the infrastructure for a banking / loan system for players needing staked SPS and for us who just want more .....?
What i do see is 6.3% less reasons for me to want to keep my SPS in a voting system which already has things against it - like 4 week lock up and better returns elsewhere etc.
Maybe it's just timing. The general public is now allowed to come up with all sorts of ideas and this proposal gives us/me less reasons to want to actively be involved in these ideas.
I wonder, as the return on the staked SPS becomes lower, who would be the voting peoples? would this help or hinder the game? 🤔
ultimately i want the best for the game also, So if everyone votes for this then clearly i'm wrong and should just shut the fk up 🤣
See the response I posted above this one to Holozor... While you are correct that you would get 6.3% SPS from staking, the value of that SPS would also be worth 6.3% more (all else being equal).
I have to downvote this. I'm all for the DAO getting a ROI on its assets, but I am against it for staking. Players are forced to stake SPS to vote and get other in game incentives. I think that APR shouldn't be taken away. Let the DAO fund SPS:DEC and SPS:HIVE. Sell the 15,000 riftwatcher refund packs sitting in its account and buy DEC and HIVE 50:50 to fund those LP. Those LP are higher APR than SPS staking anyway.
I read all the comments of this proposal and I love your idea of putting liquidity SPS in the pool to get high rewards (in case of SPS.DAO needs more funds to operate) and it will not cut down the APR of in-game staking which is pretty low at the moment.
We discussed this in Mavs Chat also, but in general I agree with the idea of leveraging other assets to get the other half of the tokens to fund the LPs. Mostly I just felt that those proposals would all be more controversial than this one. And this doesn't preclude us from also pursuing those other ideas in the future.
So The SPS.DAO will be taking away significant APR% from stakers and also dumping tons of GLX daily ont the market? just why lol
No thanks
The SPS.DAO is owned by all of us who stake SPS. The APR that the DAO would be "taking away" would be going into a fund that you have the same percentage ownership of and control over as what the DAO would be "taking away".
This proposal doesn't decide what the DAO would do with the GLX in the future. The important part for the future is that the DAO maximize its yield with the assets it has so that we have a funding structure for future rewards.
I am all for the DAO earning new sources of income, but it should not be at the expense of the community.
Good day Cryptoeater - I always respect your opinions on these things.
My first thought here is that the community owns the DAO. All of us have fractional ownership of the DAO funds in proportion to our SPS stake. This isn't at the expense of the community. It is FOR the community to have more funds to pay more returns over a longer time frame.
The second thought I have will turn into a question. This mechanism to increase the earnings for the DAO doesn't require selling SPS to initiate it. I believe we all want what is best for the Splinterlands and SPS ecosystem. I just struggle with the DAO devaluing its own token to buy other assets to pursue other mechanisms that in most cases I would consider riskier investments. What thoughts did you have on other ways the DAO could pursue generating more funds?
Sorry, but this seems like this has more ramifications than simply reduce staking gains by 6.5% but would also skew the voting system even more than it already is. Given that most of the proposals to this point have worked out to give the bigger fish more to the detriment of the smaller fish, the last thing the smaller fish need is an even weaker voice!
I'm all for ROI and passive income and currently I'm a bit like michealb on this one, I don't see why would we want to cut our own ROI for 6.3% and risking an SPS sellout of people that are here for the good ROI SPS is providing and potentially having the price of SPS crashing down from people liquidating to go invest into somewhere with better returns (like we saw happening when GLX got out with their 800% it literally crashed SPS)
Again I'm new in the DAO and I'm here to learn and vote to the best of my knowledge but right now I feel like I'm missing what are the positive in this move as we're financing the bank from every players pocket.
I'll read more of the comments but I'm really not a fan of the DAO if that mean we have to spend weeks analyzing tons of new proposal that are so technical that they will elude 80% of the small SPS holder like myself that don't understand the goal or the endgame of this proposal.
I feel like a small group of whales will run the show for us and I don't really feel like with my current understanding of the DAO and what's it's purpose that I'm qualified enough to give a vote on such a complex topic without being 100% sure I understand the full extent of such a proposition.
On top of that, I just discover this proposal from the new Proposal tab in PeakMonsters and I realize that this is already been 3 days before I even heard of this and there is currently already 2 other proposal to vote on so I guess I'll become Adminitrative Coucil full time in order to properly give a proper vote to each and every one of these proposal or I'll watch you guys run the show and vote based on my basic understanding of each of them.
Saludos algo confundido por la explicación
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Just a question: How you come to a APR of 50%.
At the website of splinterlands is written at the moment 24.49%:
As the reward pool is fixed it would decrease the APR if 28 million SPS would be staked more, so it would be even less than this 24.49% or I am wrong ?
It's in the screenshot in the proposal - the GLX rewards bring it up to 50%.
I'm more a fan of gradual changes to systems like that.
I would support staking sps acquired by the dao in the future, or a percentage of that.
As for airdropped glx to the dao, they shouldn't be dumped on the market, i don't think that would be fair towards the project. Those should be staked, perhaps a small percentage converted to dec as proposed.
Treat the thing more gently please
Honestly, for me is a yes.
In my eyes, Splinterlands is FIRST a game and THAN an investment: giving more resources to the DAO will help the sustainability of the game (because Splinterlands is a GAME) in the long-term, giving the DAO the ability to distribute more rewards to the players, fund tournaments and liquidity pools, promote the game to attract new players.
In fact, one aspect investors should keep in mind is that without a solid player base Splinterlands assets are worth 0$: who is going to buy your cards if the game is not fun and rewarding? who is going to stake SPS (thus not selling it) if it become the token of a dead game? who is going to sponsor tournaments and players if there are only investors and no players because the game has nothing to offer?
The gaming part is what keeps Splinterlands going: people buy Spinterlands assets because they hope to have fun and/or to earn something. That, and only that, allows investors to buy assets to rent and lend them, thus getting an income and a return on their investment.
If people in the first place didn't want to play the game, no one would have been allowed to rent, lend or sell anything.
Wise investors should vote thinking at what would help improving the game: make the game fun and rewarding and you'll see your assets gain value.
Voting only to preserve the value of your investment, saying "no" to everything that seems lowering your passive earnings in the short term, will slowly but surely kill the game and, with it, all our precious investments.
Good luck selling a card of a game nobody wants to play.
How do you see this affecting the GLX market, if 17K GLX tokens are then sold daily? Currently the top 15 Sell Orders on Hive total 4,500. Wouldn't this trigger an extreme race to the bottom for pricing. I guess I'm wondering the affect this has not only on the price of the token, but also the impact to the GLS/GLG project overall.
Again, it might just me be not understanding well but if I compare DAO to the government elected to take good decision for us with our taxes, I'm not sure about losing 6.3% in taxes of my APR in the hope later on I'll be sure that the money I lost today will be well invested in the future and will profit me and all the other SPS investors in the long run.
My point is if losing 6.3% now = SPS being distributed 1.3 more years and making us gain for longer period of time, fine but if it mean having more DAO stuff to be given away in some rewards later on stuff that I'm not even participating in like tournament or future season reward that only benefit a few whales or well oiled bots, no thanks I'll keep my 6.3%.
I'll vote against it until someone can come with better reason why would I want to lose money now and not be sure it will profit me later.
I won't support any proposal that benefits the DAO at the expense of the players. The project needs to be self-sufficient from revenues generated from its activities. I would, however, support using more of the funds to increase money-making opportunities.
We will make this project sustainable through free market economics, not token economics.
This will lower the APR everyone receives
I am 1000% for staking more of the sps in the dao. I dont know the exact number I would land on but your suggestion sounds good to me.
I know it was only a hypothetical but instead of selling the glx (which bro we know the dao would basically be selling into you at .03 cents lol) we should be staking the crap outta it. The SPL DAO controlling a decent bag of GLX could be a really good thing in the future.
Makes sense to me.
You got my upvote for staking the SPS. However, Selling tokens like GLX have large implications that need to be better thought through.
I am voting for it!
Capturing wealth and creating streams of income is very important for the DAO, so it will benefit us all.
We should not be afraid of loosing APR on their SPS staking because a dynamic voting system with a lot of good proposals will bring more value to SPS and push the price upward.
I'd rather have fewer useful tokens than a bunch of useless ones.
Also, thank you Splex for the good work! Very efficient as always, the first to make a really useful proposal!
100% yes on this proposal. DAO should buy DEC to stack for future LP's...
We also need a comitee to form a sub-DAO organization where small SPS holders(stackers) should be represented to stop people so called Whales manipulate the DAO at their own will... Maybe @genepoolchlrn8r is the man to start one? :)
I support this idea, Especially using the staking rewards to buy up dec.
Reducing the dec supply is crucial for our economy.
Sounds good to me :)
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Nice job. I really like the idea of having some ammunition to help stabilise tokens during tricky times and building a replacement system for the current SPS airdrop to cover battle rewards, validators etc
No brainer YES vote.
But please edit it to about half of the 28M staked. This is simply because, future proposal might require liquid SPS expenses. That need to come out of the DAO. Therefore, DAO should always carry about 50% of its asset liquid.
The proposal as written is to stake 28,000,000 SPS for a total of 30,000,000 SPS staked.
This would leave the DAO with 28,000,000 SPS liquid and higher staking rewards that would quickly get us back to the 50/50 ration you're referring to.
in that case it will be an easy decision
Yeah, got my vote.
Thank you for participating in SPS DAO Governance @genepoolchlrn8r!
You can place or monitor SPS Stake Weighted votes for and against this proposal at the link below:
Link to this Pre-Proposal
Updated At: 2023-01-19 17:01 UTC
DAO needs income, and DAO needs a piece of the game. I support.
Good proposal and I'm voting for this. I was already thinking to initiate the conversation on staking at least 50% of SPS supply in DAO. 30M SPS looks a good start!! Let's do this.
You have my sword...uh my vote!
I like it @genepoolchlrn8r and I will vote for it. I think the Staked SPS holders should start to realize they are ALL "owners of the DAO". Just like with all assets a person manages, they should always want to grow those assets.
I think some people might not want to see this pass because they might feel their own current rewards will drop. But imo that's short term thinking and also indicates they don't think they feel the DAO assets are their own.
i must be thinking short term cause i don't think this is the way.
If a bank told me that i was gunna lose 6% interest from my personal savings account but don't worry cause you have shares in the bank and you vote what the bank does with it so it's all good...... EDIT: i really don't follow this line of thinking.
For example, if the proposal was simply:
"We propose reducing the amount of SPS allocated for Staking in the whitepaper and reallocating it to the Dao instead,"
couldn't we essentially achieve the same end result?
IMO the DAO should play by the same rules everyone else does. Amending the whitepaper should be a MUCH larger effort (much like amending the constitution) than just playing by the same rules the rest of the community does.
This response is applicable to both of your two comments.