Your stakeholders are preventing the adoption of Hive.

in #hive2 years ago

Earlier today I made a post about how I want to get involved in the Hive community, I expressed how it is my goal to post more on Hive, and that I wish the large stakeholders would not continue to downvote me and deplete the rewards based on personal bias. I understand the concept of a decentralized ecosystem, the question becomes, what does it mean for a large stakeholder to be able to have this much control? Is Hive truly decentralized if the main stakeholders act on their own personal bias over who can participate in the ecosystem?

If the downvotes are the consensus, I am able to understand. If the downvotes are in relation to the content, I am able to understand. But what happens when your main stakeholders hold personal bias & act out in an attempt to silence new users?

I am not asking you to take my side, but to read through the comments left on that post. Is this the direction that Hive is going? I do not feel comfortable advocating for Hive if this is the infrastructure.

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This is the OP if you'd like to take a look for yourself: https://hive.blog/hive/@cryptofinally/i-m-trying-to-support-hive-but-whales-are-downvoting-me

I don't think this is what we're here for.

Sort:  

Honestly,

I'm of the opinion you're genuine and want what's best for Hive -

It's only one whale and he's explained his opinion. This kind of thing happens on Hive.

My advice is just carry on doing what you're doing and suck up the downvotes, you'll probably find other people will step in and upvote you anyway to reward you appropriately, there's plenty of whales that disagree with Bernie.

NB you really aren't the only one - he downvotes many people for many different reasons, Bernie uses his stake as he sees fit, that's one of the things on Hive - freedom of use of stake.

In terms of his use of language/ tone, that's just how Bernie expresses himself sometimes, try not to rise to it, it'll get you nowhere.

"It'll get you nowhere" is a great slogan for onboarding new users.

Stupid twat doesn't even understand crypto.

I appreciate the larger take, and may not have been as eloquent in my first response, but what I'm saying here is - how can you expect new users to want to onboard to this platform when this is the way that the large stakeholders behave?

I can't deny it's a problem - but I think there's enough purely positive stuff going on here on Hive for all of this to be a drop in the larger ocean I think.

4 downvotes is not a big deal in comparison to 144 upvotes on Hive, popular YouTubers or Redditors often get hundreds or thousands of downvotes per post. Don't get this too personal, focus on original, useful content and everything else will follow.

As if only the number of donwvotes would matter on HIVE ...

... and what else than personal would you call it, if every single of your posts got downvoted by the same user? "Coincidence" maybe? :)

She has no content so she needed something to whine and bitch about for attention.

Another clueless crypto influencer wannabe.

Just look at her profile photo. There’s a reason she posed the way she did. Sex sells when you’ve got no brains, right?!

People are allowed to vote how they see fit. This is freedom + decentralization. No one can tell anyone how to vote (or how to comment). There is really nothing else to say here.

She doesn't have the brains to comprehend how crypto really works. Such influencer!!!

What is this troll? If you don't like Hive, go away. You won’t like everyone - it’s like in life. The rewards for your posts are too high - you are sucking money out of the system!

She's just another ENTITLED LITTLE BRAT.

Who exactly are you appealing to here? It's a stake-based system. Welcome to crypto Cryptofinally. You might as be yelling into a void. Yes this type of system is not for everyone, and dare I say it shouldn't be. Most of us have received sizable downvotes in the past. The fact any of our posts make any money at all is absolutely amazing. You can either embrace the system and learn to live with its nuances, or you can leave. That's your choice.

Bottom line: Get more upvotes than downvotes, which you seem to have covered.

!dramatoken

First rule of #Hive: stakeholders shall do with their stake however they please. If you find innerhive to be offensive, mute him.

With this said: in order to police the reward pool and keep bad actors out, downvotes are needed. They are obviously a very bad UX; creating negative emotions in the person receiving them, due to essentially having the feeling of "money taken away", even though this is only theoretical since voting is practically a "bidding" of sorts, where stakeholders vote/downvote to determine how much a contribution should be rewarded for.

Personally, I don't think this system will help in any way the mass-adoption of Hive, neither will giving tokens away for free to "bad-content". Hence why I think the reward-logic HAS to be reworked, where stakeholders can decide for themselves who/what they support, without taking from a "global reward pool" and without having to explain themselves to others why they rewarded xyz.

It's about opinions and this actually proves how decentralised Hive is. Someone doesn't like your content,and downvotes you based on their view. It sucks but really, that's just part of the ecosystem and while it may hurt, that person's disagreement with you doesn't depict any "general" view.

Sorry about the downvotes, that sucks but I think your task now is to make your detractors believers of your work.

But why would I subject myself and others to this type of behavior? The question is about larger adoption, if I'm not comfortable here, why would I recommend this to others? And furthermore - are we to make every newcomer feel this way? I have spent a good amount of time advocating for Hive, both on my own platforms and on the platforms of many other creators. I am beginning to regret my decision now that I am seeing this high level of hate.

You're not getting hate from everyone. Surely you don't expect everyone to like you? I see your work on Twitter, and I engage your posts. I respect the work you do, however, as much as you feel you're contributing, some people may also not think the same.

Irrespective of these isolated events with you, Hive is still the best place for anyone interested in cryptocurrency to enter the market because they can literally join an ecosystem that enables them earn from their content for free, and there's no amount of downvotes that can take that away.

Just keep doing your thing and make them believers because all this works against your hive bags anyways.

Besides, upvotes is just one way to earn on hive remember? You can still earn from your stake/hive power, or even buy more hive power and pump the price of the token. In other blockchains, you usually have to invest a fair sum into buying stake before you can earn from inflation etc etc etc.

Your user base is not large enough to expect traditional content creators to adhere to the hate of the stakeholders.

This is an open market, I do not expect everyday is sunny day. Just like bitcoin, there is Peter Schiff who is attacking bitcoin vs Max Kaiser that is long believer.

Just absorb and continue hustling, atleast you don't get your account remove unlike other social media. One person do not represent everything on Hive

Your user base is not large enough to expect traditional content creators to adhere to the hate of the stakeholders.

Yes, I do agree with you. The user base is still relatively small. We are in very early phase that we are riding in a small boat of users. The problem we have today is self fixing once we become more mature in a larger boat of people. I am thinking how bitcoin in the early phase.

Downvotes mana are limited, xxxxxx are downvoting quite some people. He may eventually stop once it reach the limit. Just ignore this downvotes, its part of decentralisation. Keep safe

It's not just about the downvotes, the comments he left when I made a post about the downvotes indicates that there is a larger problem here. My point is, you can't expect the user base to grow when large stakeholders treat new users this way. It just won't happen.

You mean "Our userbase". We're all stakeholders, some have more stake than others. Increase your stake and bring that you wish for to life. At the end of the day, the code is law and all else is irrelevant.

User base as in, the amount of people who actively use Hive.

Leave then you airhead twat.

There are some big accounts on here who can also be trolls/bullies. That is the nature of Hive,but you get some good support too. Seeing as you posts make a fair bit anyway isn't it better to get on with putting out content of value rather than complaining about flags? I get flagged by some big accounts, but still earn.

Downvotes are as valid as upvotes in distributing rewards. Plenty of people would love to make more than a couple of dollars on a post and their content may be at least as good as yours.

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To support your work, I also upvoted your post!

Do not miss the last post from @hivebuzz:

Introducing the HiveBuzz API for applications and websites
Support the HiveBuzz project. Vote for our proposal!

We can see more of this, in my opinion, we don't need to entertain the negative vibes we are receiving. I am supporting you as a content creator here, xxxxx has its own opinion that do not represent anyone here but by himself. Let the wisdom of the crowd decide for our value and laser focus on our long term goal.

Our payout is like an open market that there is a buyers and sellers, a bull and a bear, the positive and negative. Hope you can get rid of this. The payout is not ours until the 7 days maturity window, we are always subject to an open market. God bless you

Let the wisdom of the crowd decide for our value and laser focus on our long term goal.

You mean the 'wisdom' of the few biggest stakeholders. :)

For short term big stakeholder affect a lot, but in long term the community concensus really matters. But who knows, maybe. Just keep on hustling

It's not about the payout, its about the social space. If Hive is representative of this kind of hate, there is no place for it. Up until this experience with these whales I have had an amazing experience on Hive, I have advocated for Hive across all of my platforms, and with many leaders & creators in the space - but if this is the direction that Hive is heading, I am not comfortable continuing to do so. I hope that Hive can understand my perspective on this, as I'm sure many newcomers will feel this way, when large stakeholders treat you with such vitriol, why even bother posting?

This is not "the direction" hive is going simply because you were downvoted.
Downvotes only show disagreement with content/author, not anything else. Don't forget, hive is also a cryptocurrency so shilling it is still in your benefit when you consider your bags.

Sorry about the downvotes but like I said, it is not the "direction" of Hive. It is a downvote.

It's not just the downvotes at this point. I made one post about the downvotes indicating that I have tons of love for Hive and want to be here, the comments by your high ranking stakeholders are what truly put me off.

They're still just people speaking their mind. Some large stakeholders also like you. At least you have their attention, so it means you're doing something right or wrong...either ways, you're doing something.

Nobody has the time or energy in their lives to be torn down and insulted the way your high ranking stakeholders have done to me. This will not adopt under these circumstances.

He was insulting this way the Steemit, Inc team and anyone who disagreed with him for years. He's always been this way.

Doesn't mean that how he talks is okay. You can always mute him. That's what I would do if I was in your place.

Dumb cry baby bitch.

You can use mute button on negative people you dont want to see. Just like any other social media, there are bashers here. Just get rid of it, you really did a good job in my opinion. Cheers

Appreciate it, thank you.

Unfortunately, we can't control who buys Hive and becomes a whale... It wouldn't be decentralized otherwise.

What is sad is that he doesn't even see he is hurting his own stake.

But it will pass.

It's all about the payout for you.

Your life is being a paid shill. You're nothing more than a pretty face with nothing between the ears.

Just mute him and accept the downvotes if he keeps downvoting. There are loads of people he doesn't like he can't downvote everyone. He'll eventually stop.

Another drama means there's a community here! That's a good sign! There are no dramas left on Steem.

As for the topic, I am not a fan of your content and do not agree with you on many topics, but on the other hand you have become a celebrity of sort. Hive is a free to express place, but still it's not a free support space. So expect no support, except no more than what hive really is. The Hive is also a place where you can freely express your negative opinion and use your stake to support it.

Your user base is not large enough to expect traditional content creators to adhere to the hate of the stakeholders.

It's part of the reason the base is small, even with a great product and a market for it.

We can't quite solve the Free Speech and Free Stake problem.

Everyone has different taste, ideally you could post what you want.. but also xxxx can respond in text and with his stake.

That's all it is a stake-based vote and mean words... 1 person - also it's not even that personal to you, it's a common occurrence across a wide group of people.

Is it a smart decision to be rude to people when trying to grow a product? Not in my opinion. HOWEVER, in DPOS system it is the stakeholders' right to make both good and bad decisions. The other stakeholders can counter or not. Invest accordingly...

It will not adopt under these circumstances. I have done nothing but advocate for Hive, the way that the large stakeholders are behaving is an embarrassment to the entire operation.

Yeah, you will not be the first, the biggest or the last influencer to have the whales turn against them.

I also won't be the first, biggest, or last, to give up on this platform due to it - correct?

Correct, but consider this: Perhaps you can't have it both ways. Polite, nice, and controlled

OR

Wild, Rude, Uncalled for and also decentralized and free.

I'm not sure you can pick both

The question is - why will people onboard & what will prevent them from doing so? The devils advocate is not going to grow a user base.

She's not an influencer! She's a fucking airhead who attracts men that love the little girl look.

Nothing more!!!

Another ignorant cunt....

That is true! Can't argue with that.

You have no user base. Your followers are mostly fake. Dummy.

I see you've met @bernie :D

This is a good sign we have a healthy community. A drama popcorn is needed 😂❤👇

images 4.jpeg

Do you realize this is a post questioning if Hive is an appropriate platform for larger onboarding? The user base is not large enough to expect creators to subject themselves to this kind of behavior by large stakeholders.

DJ Khalid says it best...

They don't want you to eat breakfast so what we gon' do is we gon' eat breakfast.

#WeTheBest #BlessUp

Is Hive truly decentralized if the main stakeholders act on their own personal bias over who can participate in the ecosystem?

Yes. It's a stake based system.

P.S. Your posts are 2/3 just referral links and you get $25+ per post. I can see why your content is not appreciated by some people.

easy.

  • MUTE
  • Start using peakd.com
  • Settings > Content > Use author muting preferences "ON"

done

Hmmmm and if someone on youtube, twitter or whatever dont like you, you start crying too?

Upvotes and Downvotes balance out, and nobody can censor you? I dont get the problem?

Mimimimi i earn less because someone downvote me? Thats part of the game.

For sure getting insulted is not cool, but you can mute.

I can only say feel free to leave.

Btw some notice. On Wordpress, medium and other Blogging sites are way more inactive Users / Accounts.

The active user rate is not bad compare to them.

This is her pathetic life. Without people loving her, she's nothing.

Every downvote that is placed on a piece of content adds rewards back to the pool for every other user on the Hive platform.

@louisthomas had a similar problem a while ago, maybe he can share how he dealt with it.

*Downvoted due to excessive auto votes for a minimal quality post.

As far as content on hive, I not even a huge fan of you currently and still think it would be silly for you not to see the benefit of cross posting here If your goal is monetizing content. If you want to quit due to one person downvoting you, cool. But quite frankly I don’t see the issue - make content more stakeholders want to vote and that one accounts downvotes would be countered.

Oh, btw.. why you were here talking shit and acting like a victim, I had a discussion about the value you could add and believe you won’t have anymore issues. Feel free to go back to just cross posting and collecting those sweet rewards.

Hot tip, the more you support hive out there, the more support you’ll get here 🙂 Also some tips on posts - original to hive will always get the biggest votes: and try to add a bit of substance to the post itself, the downvotes would have never came if that was done. When a stakeholder seems no effort whatsoever and high rewards, it’s their job to protect that stake and balance the rewards to reflect value. So perhaps you could improve upon that a bit.

Good luck..

Any maybe don't talk shit about the women who have a clue and have actually done something for Hive?

The airhead is fucking clueless. Clearly doesn't understand how crypto of Hive work. She doesn't deserve any more than the other leeches.

Talking shit is irrelevant. If the issue is rewards, learning how the system works and improving content to get better rewards or prevent downvotes due to over rewards seems like the logical solution.

You are completely over-reacting to one or two whale downvotes.

In the whole spiel you've quoted above there is only one comment that could be classified as a personal attack, rather than an opinion on your content.

You are really making a big balagan over nothing.

Much bigger content creators than you have come to Hive and had a harder time at first than you. @tommyrobinson being a case in point.

He had well over a million Facebook followers before he was banned there.
When he started cross-posting his original content from his owned website Steem Cleaners called him a plagarist and put him on a blacklist.
They then asked him to verify his identity by posts on Facebook & Twitter where he had been banned.
Talk about adding insult to injury.

But he persevered and got the issues resolved.

He's now a happy Hiver.

I hope you too will learn the system and succeed.
You (and everyone else) needs Hive more than Hive needs them.

I hope you too will learn the system and succeed.

Don't you think that it's a bit too naive/stubborn to try to force human behavior around a system, instead of adopting/improving the system based on human behavior? How many people are still here vs. how many people have left Steem/Hive over the years?

Just because "hardcore Hivers" are still here, doesn't mean that the system in this state is suitable for the general masses. Some people might have a high enough threshold to accept whales systematically downvoting their content, but I don't think the average joe will want to deal with that "negativity". There's a reason why most social media haven't implemented "dislikes", and if they implemented it, they were just "empty" reactions, not filled with negative monetary value.

IMHO the idea of people "bidding" for how much of a global reward pool should be given to a contribution is brilliant, but I don't think it's suitable for the average population social media content. I think it's better suited for closed entities - such as companies; not global & anonymous social networks without any accountabilities.

It is a very interesting question you pose.

You are saying that whale downvoting and the "negativity" that goes with it is a consequence of the Hive system.

But in my view the Hive system IS adapted to human group behaviour. That includes both positive and negative feedback, inequalities of power and the fact that new entrants to a community have to learn the (often unwritten) rules of acceptable behaviour.

These are key features of ALL human communities. This is true across cultures and since the dawn of time. It is even true of primate communities.

Part of the reason that centralised social media is so toxic and uncivil is that there are no community consequences for bad behaviour, only the massive sledgehammer of centralised banning. There is nothing at stake. Having only positive feedback mechanisms is extremely problematic as it goes against human nature.

It is centralised social media that has got human behaviour terribly wrong with devastating consequences for the world.

I'm sure blart and zapata will be happy to have you.
Take your bid botted stake and go.

chump

As salty as ever @freebornangel, eh? Some people never change 😉

I changed my name, if not my persona.

If by salty you mean unforgiving of your coming here and profiting from harming the chain, then yeah, I will take that.

Have you done something I can be proud of?

I have more followers than him on Hive right now. I believe you that he wanted to be here, but it clearly was not extremely successful for him. Your user base is not large enough to expect traditional content creators to adhere to the hate of the stakeholders. The question is about adoption - what draws people to your platform, and what prevents them from participating?

You're an ignorant twat bag.

Not successful here??? Steem made me fucking rich and that comment shows your lack of knowledge about the history here.

That comment was not about you, though I can tell you're used to a world where everything is.

I stand by my statement.

Don't you feel a bit pathetic relying on your looks to get you by?

YOU WIN FOR BEING THE WHINIEST CRYPTO BIMBO!!!!