An exploration into community nodes, content value, autovotes, patrons and improving user experience on Hive

in #hive-16792221 days ago

Is it wrong to earn on valuable content?

In an earlier post, I looked at the experience of content being the indicator and driver of value, where the consumer was able to get benefit across various value streams, for example, monetary, practical or sentimental - possibly all three (or more) in combination. @abh12345 was the catalyst for the article and then added more to the conversation through comments about what valuable content is and how he feels over-rewarded so doesn't post often. While there is merit to this, I have a potentially slightly different perspective that deserves a little exploration, so here we are today.

I think part of the issue for me is that I try to look at my/a post without taking the author into consideration. And if I do that with my stuff, whilst taking the pending payouts into consideration, I think they are over-rewarded, and that puts me off doing anything the following day to repay, or not take out more than I think I should get.
@abh12345
comment source

Is it over-rewarded?

Firstly, I think that the idea of "over-rewarded" is a difficult concept to approach, as it can't be done on a post by post basis as that doesn't take into consideration network and value based on past performance, and it can't be done based on a static amount, as that doesn't take into consideration the post itself, but more importantly - there is essentially no way to know how valuable a post or a network of relationships is now, a week from now, or 5 years from now. Not only this, no one knows for sure what adds value and what does not on the short- to long-term timeline.

The other issue that I think those who are little Hive wrinklier than others might suffer from is that we remember highs and lows, bidbots and massive voting circles and self-voting - when the rewards were split 75/25 between author and curator. Now that it is 50/50, the amount an author gets is less, so the bar (whatever that might be) for over-rewarded comes down.

I am glossing over this area because that is not quite what I want to explore here today, it is more my answer to the above comment.

Consider that the rewards that you get on your post are from people who are supporting where value and engagement happens, they are essentially supporting the ecosystem using your content as a proxy. I see accounts like yours much like community nodes, gathering points of value and engaged users looking to improve their experience. In many ways, you not posting might have a detrimental effect on the community.

Value is attractive

As I said, "No content is valuable until it adds value to our experience" but this doesn't mean it can't attract value. To illustrate this, in the past (and perhaps today) there were people literally posting "." and then rewarding themselves handsomely for it and even attracting external votes under the approach that, a post is a placeholder for votes and therefore the content doesn't matter. They are correct, a post is a placeholder for votes, but that doesn't mean its contents don't matter.

The contents of a post matter because they affect experience of the audience in many ways, internally and externally. A highly paid post of "." doesn't likely inspire an external investor to consider this a an investment vehicle for a social community and it definitely doesn't bring value or improve the experience of internal users, it detracts. In general, we can accept rewards on posts that have some effort put into them and generate some decent level of positive interaction, but we are far more critical of low-effort, low-engagement, highly-rewarded content - because, it affects our experience negatively. I use "positive" as value-adding to the community by the way, not lack of criticism or negative feelings, for those who might think I mean cheer-leading.

The same rewarded value on a post with effort put in and engagement is acceptable because either it directly affects our experience positively as engaging and interesting for us or, we can see how other people are or could have their experience positively affected by it. This means that there is value in the post beyond it being a mere placeholder for votes to settle to extract rewards from the pool, as it can directly affect experience. The contents of the post could do things such as, help users better understand a system or a process and develop their approach to improving their experience, it could get them thinking and generate more content, it can connect people through the comments, be shared out externally, help someone feel better about their life, introduce them to a new concept or an investment opportunity, give them something good to read on any given day, influence a power up... it can improve the experience of individuals to strengthen the community, which further improves the experience of individuals.

Compounding the effects of value with trust

Good content has a compounding effect that is compounded at a greater rate the better the network development and relationships involved are. Because compounding effects are difficult to gauge at the best of times, let alone in a dynamic community like Hive, we generally oversimplify the value down to post "quality" and "reward" on given post - and then skip what we can't observe easily, which is a lot. And this is where it gets more contentious and the waters are muddied.

The way it affects will depend on the contents of the post, as well as the relationship that the audience has on various aspects around the post. While Asher might "try not to consider the author" in regards to the value of the post, unfortunately it is impossible once a relationship has been formed, as it will put in bias. Not only that, in regards to affecting the experience of the audience (better or worse), the author's "reputation" (not the number) is a key influencer - there is a trust component and this is the internet and crypto, earning the trust of an audience is no easy feat.

Track-record, engagement ability, content delivery, usefulness of information, level of interaction, behavior and many other attributes that lead toward build trust around content and author have to be performed consistency to develop that trust. The more these type of things happens, the better the relationships build and a gravity starts to form that attracts more into the experience surrounding the content. While an individual post can get highly rewarded, this consistent mass of interaction around an account such as @abh12345, is indicative of the relationships he has developed by being trusted in the community - not only for his data-driven content, but for him as a person, him as Asher the human.

Affecting experience and behavior

What an account like @abh12345 has managed by demonstrating many positive community-driven behaviors consistently over time, is build a meeting point, like a cafe, where many people collect and interact, meet friends and strangers, learn, ask questions, connect, support each other and improve their experience. This is what I call a "community node" where the transactions created are social in form and directly affect the experience of individuals and they way they behave on the platform. In my experience, the greatest driver of positive change in behavior is leading by example.

This doesn't sound contentious so far, until we start to look into the financial aspects of it, the rewards, and things like autovoters. A lot of people don't like "blind" autovoters (including some who get them) but I (I do get some) have a different take on it, at least partially. Autovoters are blind to post contents, but aren't actually blind, as they are set by a human. What this means is that a human will have to at some point evaluate and chose where they are going to set their votes, whether their approach is to maximize their curation, minimize their needed effort, try to improve the experience of users or increase the value of Hive.

Community sensitive autovotes

It is probably quite difficult for the largest stakeholders to effectively distribute their stake widely, as each vote can be so large that they have to split it. When a person has a vote of 50 dollars, splitting it into 20 dollar blocks would require reading 25 posts a day that they would consider "being worth" the reward personally - how many do you read? So, they might set autos or delegate to curation trails.

How they set their autos as a large investor is likely to be in a somewhat healthier way as they know that what they vote on will gain visibility and therefore, attract attention - positive and negative. With the free downvotes, negative attention will cost them curation returns, but also as an investor, supporting crap doesn't support their investment. But, they likely do not have the personal bandwidth to read a large number of posts daily, but also do not want to miss out on returns or perhaps more importantly for them, their voice in the organization of content that they believe is value-adding to the community and therefore, their investment.

Discovering community value

The challenge is finding accounts that "qualify" for autos, but this isn't very hard as long as you are paying some attention to the social transactions and the behaviors surrounding the "popular" community nodes. What I mean by this is that if for example you look at @abh12345 posts (or several other popular community nodes), you will find that not only is the engagement high, it is also relatively good where people put effort into the discussion and there is very little spam. Any new user who chances upon this kind of content will get a very good lesson in positive community engagement beyond the contents of the post itself. Not only this, the types of accounts engaging are also often smaller community accounts also who exhibit a lot of positive behaviors - they are the most engaged accounts on the platform and "funnily enough", often the ones who are also investing and growing.

This gives someone looking to set an auto a target that will earn them some curation on content that will be considered suitable by the community because it is decent quality and engaging in ways that are positive for the platform - and their investment into Hive. They can predict this based on the track-record of the account, because those that "can't be trusted" do not get consistent daily engagement in meaningful or positive ways. From this perspective, autovotes are akin to patrons of the arts, people who supported artists so that they could produce and add value to the community in some way - the return the patron gets is not only in curation rewards, it is also in being able to support an account to grow that consistently delivers value to the audience in ways that positively affect their experience.

Is Proof-of-Brain dead?

As said, this is where there might be more of a split in agreement as "value-adding" is very difficult to gauge in a dynamic environment, but this is actually a slice of Proof-of-Brain at work, where a patron is using the "wisdom of the crowd" as an oracle to tell them where community value lays. For me, I have been consistently getting autos for some time and as I have written about several times earlier, I make sure that I put my best foot forward in each post, even though each post might not be gold. The reason is that if one of those autos does drop by to see what I am up to (many of my autos also comment from time to time as well), they will find something worthy of their stake, something they can say is at the very least, acceptably value-adding. Of course, there is leeway here too as I write in a range of genres and topics.

Developing community nodes

I have a fair amount of experience on this platform from various perspectives and for years have been espousing the concept of community nodes for example in this one from 2017, "building community nodes" which might be worth a read. These gathering points are vital for the health of the platform as meeting points for all kinds of users and the dissemination of all kinds of information, as well as being able to effectively improve experience through the genuine interaction and a lead by example approach. It is because of this that I feel that these account not posting is far more costly to the platform than the amounts that they might take on a post, even if from time to time ta particular post isn't their best - everyone has off-days - and the off days are often value adding anyway, as the audience interaction will arrive to add weight to the content.

Attentive in an attention economy

I did say, there might be a lot of disagreement with some aspects of this post, but I think that the compounding effects of content, author and the relationships formed have to be taken into consideration heavily before judging whether a post is over-rewarded or not, including by the author themselves. When it comes to building a strong community, pillars of some kind are generally needed to support the increasing height and on Hive, some of these pillars are contributors that provide a space for social connections of various kinds.

The other thing to consider is that while a particular pillar might get rewarded, one also has to look at what kinds of value streams are swirling around it, what kinds of relationships are forming and what knock-on affects they are having on the rest of the community. Often, it is new initiatives, new communities and new community nodes forming. In time, these spread wider to support a continually growing userbase of diverse content and background.

So, while autovotes and highly-rewarded posts can generate a lot of disagreement and conversation around what is valuable, the value the account generates itself has to be factored into the calculations. This is more difficult to do, but quite easy to observe if paying attention. This is an attention economy, are you being attentive?

See you at one of the community bars.

Taraz
[ Gen1: Hive ]

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I couldn't help thinking about artists and actors who feel over rewarded for their success, feeling guilt for being successful when so many other aspiring artists are struggling.

I think Hive more than anywhere is ideal for people who are over rewarded. Success means that you can delegate, upvote including autovotes, and lead communities to do whatever good things your influence allows. More importantly, a large enough account can have helpers distribute votes.

In the physical world, a successful artist couldn't delegate their wealth. They would have to donate it or bear the cost of running a campaign. That's very different here on Hive. One doesn't have to give away anything to help the community.

There are some people I have on autovote because they are consistent in the quality of their work. But, there aren't too many people on autovote. I agree that to some degree this is like patreon.

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Do you think they do feel guilt over this? I think a lot of the actors are often so self-absorbed that they might not care about those doing the hard yards.

More importantly, a large enough account can have helpers distribute votes.

This is becoming more and more common with large accounts as they just don't have the bandwidth to spend reading - but want their votes to matter where they want to matter.

That's very different here on Hive. One doesn't have to give away anything to help the community.

This will become much more apparent and vital when price moves. There was once a big news story about Dash giving something like 10,000 dollars to help Venezuela, an amount that was going out to them on Steem weekly at the time. Price makes a lot of things far more likely and, a lot can be done, we just have to get there.

I think you may be right about actors to some extent. I think at the very least they have to pretend to feel guilt.

I didn't know about how much Steem was going out to Venezuela. That's fascinating. It reminds me that I have the means to buy up more Hive and should do it. This would increase my position, make a very small contribution to raising the price, and help me make a difference in the lives of those who rely on rewards. Even though I know that this works, it's hard to believe that everybody is winning here.

It isn't that high now, but I remember someone getting an audit done and it was a lot, because the pool was worth much more. Currently the pool is about 200K worth, but when HIVE is 4 dollars, it would be worth about 3.2 million - that is a lot of spread.

Even though I know that this works, it's hard to believe that everybody is winning here.

it isn't much of a win at current market price, but if the pool increases significantly so it is, it is a bargain to buy now. Most people want the value now though, so sell. necessity may play a role for some, but not all.

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Doesn't take into consideration network and value based on past performance

And even potential future performance, it's naive to expect that votes will always be the same. Can consider it as a downpayment if that helps. Also there is all additional time invested that's no seen in a post, but you've explained that much better.

Meeting point, like a cafe, where many people collect and interact...

Pretty sure I discovered @abh12345 first, and then your blog through him :)

Autovoters are blind to post contents, but aren't actually blind, as they are set by a human.

Autovotes can be set as a backup even, I strongly believe everyone should have autovotes as a backup, if a vote % is 95+ recharged. Life is simply unpredictable.

Of course, there is leeway here too as I write in a range of genres and topics.

A risk worth taking. I feel bad for anyone stuck doing one thing only, to the point where their whole livelihood depends on it, so they can't do anything else that interests them.

In the end, I believe in trusting the gut, but always testing and pushing the comfort zone.

future performance is where a lot might go wrong in several areas - firstly, they rape autos and then expect them to last. Secondly, they have an expectation that once supported, the support is forever.

Pretty sure I discovered @abh12345 first, and then your blog through him :)

It is common and hopefully I send a few people around the place too :)

A risk worth taking. I feel bad for anyone stuck doing one thing only, to the point where their whole livelihood depends on it, so they can't do anything else that interests them.

My blog is personal and while I focus on the community, all of it is an expression of different sides of my life. I don't stay narrow because my life is far from narrow - as they say, write what you know and I will add, explore what you don't know.

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Autovotes can be set as a backup even, I strongly believe everyone should have autovotes as a backup, if a vote % is 95+ recharged. Life is simply unpredictable.

Yeah, I should really look into doing this. I’m still doing all-manual creation. But there are situations where real life intervenes and I don’t have the time or ability to curate. It’s just wrong to have VP at 100 percent.

A little later I can look for my old post for how to set it up. I made it back in the days for Steem, but the interface is exactly the same for Hive version :)

Good luck, it's incredibly easy once you figure out the basics :) Also you can set any percent you want to activate the autovotes, even at 99%.

I think that it is an important factor that you have mentioned. : the human factor. The human Asher, Taraz, Galen and Mary and others etc etc. When you read and scroll through the posts and notice the content through time then you can start to connect. The pillars of Hive will take time to be built. A person's value here is sum of factors. As you said, some are valuable to the point that if they do not post they affect the community as a whole.

I think that beyond investment, people search for quality and connection. No use of throwing support just to spread that vote. A vote is not only an investment, but also a mirror of those who vote. I doubt that valuable people will cast their vote randomly just to check voting off the " to do list" for the day.

Quality, engagement, the human connection is what will contribute to the longterm well being of anyone enjoying the Hive's wonderful universe.

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When you read and scroll through the posts and notice the content through time then you can start to connect.

This is a massive part of the experience, it becomes one of friendship and over time, it will more and more cross into the real world too.

As you said, some are valuable to the point that if they do not post they affect the community as a whole.

I think Asher falls into this category, especially through the data posts, as many people use them to fine tune and track their experience.

I doubt that valuable people will cast their vote randomly just to check voting off the " to do list" for the day.

Most don't I assume, but they might vote without reading on some people knowing that there is a high probability of value.

Quality, engagement, the human connection is what will contribute to the longterm well being of anyone enjoying the Hive's wonderful universe.

It is why I stay.

That's why we all stay. We= those who connect.

It has been interesting to observe this over the years as with little exception, the engaged stay far longer and under much more stressful conditions.

The power of connection pulling you through the rough times. I think this also happens in real life. The stronger the connection, the more it lasts in front of adversity

I wonder if that was one of your longest yet? I loved the node concept, I think communities are going to be the backbone of Hive, and there are definitely certain accounts and communities that act as nodes/coffee stop shops.

Reward levels have and I think always will be a thing that people have a hard time with. Some people are pretty generous, and it can make it feel odd to be on the receiving end, not so odd a feeling to be on the giving end though. So I understand how some can feel about the "over" reward part. The votes are coming from a lot of people, it is not a rancho-hajien thing, a one party voter.

I entered a 'contest', to try and learn, and was the recipient of a real good delegation for a a bit, at the time it felt weird, that it was to much, it took almost halfway through the preset time that I stopped feeling weird about it. I won another contest thing for something I love to do anyway, and thought it was to much of a reward, so I donated half back for the next round.

As we grow, we tend to forget the frustrations of why no rewards, and then we have the frustration of why so big a reward, then we learn that it is what it is, people find you or you find people, or you go out and hunt for people, like you do content, the networking part of hive, and then it seems it doesn't really matter, all that matters is the fun factor.

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I wonder if that was one of your longest yet?

Up there, but probably not. I have some long ones.

Some people are pretty generous, and it can make it feel odd to be on the receiving end, not so odd a feeling to be on the giving end though.

Yes, I feel weird and grateful for the support, I also feel good giving it out - so I understand why they like doing it :)

The votes are coming from a lot of people, it is not a rancho-hajien thing, a one party voter.

Yes, and a lot of them are not actually autos. Some of the largest votes I get are manual. Same for many of the users here - there are still large accounts that read.

I won another contest thing for something I love to do anyway, and thought it was to much of a reward, so I donated half back for the next round.

I heard about this :)

and then it seems it doesn't really matter, all that matters is the fun factor.

It is kind of like the twelve step healing guide - hopefully we will all sober up and have some real fun :)

I see you have not hit the rainy summer season yet, it has been a wet rainy couple of days for us since solstice, so out door pictures and hunts are slow for me. I just hope it gives us a break, still lots of summer left and fun things to do outside, in the meantime, fun things on line.

Sunday should see a summer storm roll in, but today was 29 and tomorrow 31 degrees, so pretty warm. We have been swimming at the lake a lot and I hope there will be more to come.

It was hard in the garden today though, I might even lose some weight :)

How many people complain about being "over" rewarded?

It takes a special soul to worry about it and @abh12345 is one of those.
He certainly deserves every cent that he gets, but I doubt that we will get him to agree to this :)

As far as curation goes, I am one of those that don't do too well, but I am not complaining.
We get out what we put in and if we have a bag of crypto knowledge in our arsenal, so much the better. Pity someone stole my bag of crypto knowledge :) Trying for a smile here!

Now it's time for coffee after reading so many words here and I have to be careful, as I just might become informed!

My cafe has a few good readers and commentators and I base most of my posts on their attention, as they like it.

Oh! I just saw something that maybe you can write about?
I posted about the bird that I snapped today. Not any bird, as this one is the longest distance flying bird in the world!

A new record that I set with 104 votes and only 1 reply complementing the sea' waves thus far??????

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Thank you kindly @tarazkp

Asher is "special" :)

Pity someone stole my bag of crypto knowledge

I hold a few bags of crypto - not much knowledge :)

Now it's time for coffee after reading so many words here and I have to be careful, as I just might become informed!

We don't want that. Stay away from being informed as a little knowledge goes a long way

My cafe has a few good readers and commentators and I base most of my posts on their attention, as they like it.

I think that this is an area where people should spend their time, doing what they do for the people who enjoy. People doing what they enjoy is attractive and more will follow.

Remember that most of the votes are autos :)

Unnerving this auto vote thing. I remember how impressed I was the first time some of them appeared on my posts.

Especially as at the time I did no auto voting and to date I still struggle with it.

I thought Wow and Wow again, the people liked my posts!

What a let down when I discovered what it really is.

What is interesting to note is that on nearly all other sites that have public "like" metrics, a lot of it is autovotes.

We never had that on the first paid site that I entered. it was named Tsu, and steemit was the second site, so now with Hive it is only 3 sites that have been on, so I wouldn't know.

I presume a lot of sites have "like" metrics to draw passive investments?

I mean Facebook, Instagram, YouTube and the like - transactions have value, as does the appearance of popularity - so the sites add in unverifiable transactions and people also buy follower lists that vote on their posts to try and attract advertisers and sponsors.

Ah yes and sorry for misunderstanding.
Of course you are right as most everything in life consist of one or another kind of transaction.
One can buy votes on Facebook, that I know. Youtube and everyone else also have their own transactions in deals with advertisers and such. (often hidden from the public eye) We only have to look at their results to see that transactions have value.

My simple example of a transaction is this;
I offer a woman a lovely ring, she accepts my proposal(marraige) and I pay her for the rest of my life hahaha.

Just trying to get a forlorn smile out of you!

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(often hidden from the public eye)

This is where a lot of the danger lays, as people do not know what is being hidden and- "seeing is believing"

I offer a woman a lovely ring, she accepts my proposal(marraige) and I pay her for the rest of my life hahaha.

I offer a woman a lovely ring, she accepts my proposal(marraige) and I pay her for (it) the rest of my life hahaha.

That picture of the lake is awesome.

abh12345 is one of those really rare people who has managed to make statistical analysis widely appealing and engaging.

I pretty much took everyone except a few accounts off auto curation, but I follow a lot of voting trails (different game).

Actually one of my favorite experiments was when I was maximizing curation by only following underrated curation initiatives. Communities has removed the need for mamy of those.

One idea I have is to just set curation to vote posts with a specific tag like #5HBDpost or #20HBDpost if it is under that value...but it would involve people having to determine what they are worth which makes some people uncomfortable. In most cases who is better to ask than OP?

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That picture of the lake is awesome.

It is part of a series of the best sunset I have ever seen and I am glad I had my camera :)

@abh12345 is one of those really rare people who has managed to make statistical analysis widely appealing and engaging.

He does this to make up for his personality (I tagged him) ;D

The setting the cap takes out the possibility of the "lottery effect" and I think the people who set it generally know they are going to get rewarded very heavily, regardless of what they post. Not many use it.

Thanks for this :)

I did have a read earlier but have been busy and put it on the later pile, I think that covers one of the comments you got.

From the 2017 post:

The more nodes willing to sacrifice a short-term reward for a long-term gain, the more long-term benefits will start affecting the short-term situation.

It's been a thought of mine since I started getting serious with Steem towards the end of 2017. And I think that...

Those with long-term views and the SP to back it up should be not just supporting good content, but supporting the nodes that will inspire more good content and long-term providers.

Started to happen around then for me, but has certainly come to the fore over the past year or so.

I'm not too keen on being dubbed a community leader, but will accept 'community node' - the EL post, thanks to those that engage there has felt like that with so many comments not directed at me, it's nice.

I feel that these account not posting is far more costly to the platform than the amounts that they might take on a post

Argh, I'll have a look for some data then :)

Started to happen around then for me, but has certainly come to the fore over the past year or so.

Yep, a few started seeing the potential of building the network in a more healthy manner and it has worked, considering what else has happened concurrently.

I'm not too keen on being dubbed a community leader, but will accept 'community node'

I agree, leader sounds far too formal and centralized, node or hub is more of an opt-in community centre :)

Argh, I'll have a look for some data then :)

I don't know where to start with this one.

I'm still trying to understand how a curator gets 50% of the total payout to a post. The author only gets half the payout. What if there are several comments on a post, do they share the 50% curation payout?

The commentators get rewarded on a case by case basis, not from the post rewards.

edit:

a comment is actually a post. Often you will hear someone say "top level post" - which is the main/normal post.

Aha good to know, I appreciate the insight @tarazkp.

no worries mate.

Curators, or the voters, share the 50% depending on the size/timing of their vote. Commentators, if they didn't vote, don't take a share.

Fascinating architecture on the blockchain code there. I vaguely remember this info coming out in a HF or some such event on the old Steemit platform, now that you remind me. I was unhappy about the shift in allocation initially, but in reality it encourages comments and engagement I presume.

I don't think being 'over-rewarded' is too much of an issue, eventually the market will sort out who gets the higher votes on what basis.

If we ever get an influx of serious creatives then I'm sure many autovotees will switch their votes accordingly, making the daily churn-to-earn mentality less appealing.

Also, I'm sure @abh12345 would agree that not posting every day is a lot easier now his curation return is up due to a larger stake.

That 50-50 split has made a difference - a lot of people stopped posting almost immediately after the 50-50 split - the most notable was exyle, now he's just a mere passive investor, on both Steem and Hive I note. Can't say I miss those 'daily dinner selfies' that used to earn $25 a pop.

I sort of know what he means though, I wouldn't want to break the unwritten rule of posting more than twice a day (actually for me it's usually once) just to milk an autovote.

I also think the weekly limit thing helped too.

What is your 'fair share' is an interesting question! I think that one goes back to before Homo-sapiens!

I don't think being 'over-rewarded' is too much of an issue, eventually the market will sort out who gets the higher votes on what basis.
I don't think being 'over-rewarded' is too much of an issue, eventually the market will sort out who gets the higher votes on what basis.

Yep, I agree and while there will be space for all kinds of content, the spread will be far greater and there will be less peaks. Having said that, if the price is supported be growing demand, the amounts will be far greater than today, as the HIVE pool (or whichever SMT has value) will stretch much further. You remember the runs from 2017/18 and how much some posts were getting and how far it was going. Back then unfortunately, there wasn't a large community and a lot of abuse - the next time could be different.

the most notable was exyle, now he's just a mere passive investor, on both Steem and Hive I note.

I think there were other reasons that affected this too :D

Can't say I miss those 'daily dinner selfies' that used to earn $25 a pop.

Yep, low value all-round the board - but self-voting was still a thing

I sort of know what he means though, I wouldn't want to break the unwritten rule of posting more than twice a day (actually for me it's usually once) just to milk an autovote.

I have been posting a lot more in the past because I really enjoy the writing. I have cut back heavily since getting picked up by autos though and, my content has probably grown in length accordingly :D

I also think the weekly limit thing helped too.

A lot of people didn't know there was a change and were sitting at 100%

What is your 'fair share' is an interesting question! I think that one goes back to before Homo-sapiens!

People will always underestimate the worth others have, and overestimate their own.

I agree with most of what you say. But still, as I look at this post 1 hour in with 28$ and no comments it does make me wonder how this is precieved by newcomers to the site.
For me the reward pool is becoming more of a Patreon model than about content discovery and I feel it is getting more difficult for new bloggers to break through this wall.

But still, as I look at this post 1 hour in with 28$ and no comments it does make me wonder how this is precieved by newcomers to the site.

Only if they discover it in the first hour or two. Many of my posts take time to gather comments for a couple reasons, firstly because it is longer people who often read my work will save it for later, secondly because it is often the kind of stuff that takes time to comment on, people wait for when they have time to comment. If you read through the comment sections of most of my posts, you will see that the level of comment is quite good and thought goes into the replies, in both directions.

For me the reward pool is becoming more of a Patreon model than about content discovery and I feel it is getting more difficult for new bloggers to break through this wall.

It was always going to happen by design and most likely, the rewards from the HIVE pool will stop completely on content, as there will hopefully be many rewarding pools through SMTs, each designed to empower creators in different ways.

Your posts bring a lot of wisdom to Hive with each one being like a thesis and worthy of the share of the reward pool they get. I hope my comment didn't come across negatively. Maybe my bug bare when it comes to autovotes made me shoot off the cuff.
This place is very much a work in progress and for me it is fascinating to see how things develop. When bid bots were doing the rounds it was so frustrating being a content creator but now slowly but surely I am seeing that if you put the work in, in all aspects of the platform you can get somewhere. Although, it can be slow at times.
With the many different communities starting up and possibly SMTs I do hope that people will find their success whatever their niche.
Personally I am very happy with my success so far. Although it has been hard got, it makes me proud of it even more and as I near Dolphin status I feel I am one of the success stories using Steem (now Hive) as it was advertised.
This is a great learning experience.

I hope my comment didn't come across negatively.

I don't mind regardless - we all have our various issues and autovotes are a grey area for me, depending on the content they find. There are some "authors" who offer very little value in any way, but have taken a massive amount through autos and self votes for 4 years - it is frustrating, but, it is sorting itself out.

When bid bots were doing the rounds it was so frustrating being a content creator but now slowly but surely I am seeing that if you put the work in, in all aspects of the platform you can get somewhere. Although, it can be slow at times.

Yep, I was pretty outspoken at this time on it (my first post against them was the week after the very first started in july-ish 2017) and I didn't really let up and worked toward the future move from them in various ways. My posts like this one were getting a couple dollars much of the time, and prices was well up from here. But, consistency, adding value where possible, participating well.. it does add up.

Although it has been hard got, it makes me proud of it even more and as I near Dolphin status I feel I am one of the success stories using Steem (now Hive) as it was advertised.

If it was easy, would you value it as much? Watching many of those who have got it easy, they don't hold much now.

I read all the comments, there are some authors, (taraz, sauravrungta), and a few others that I will vote, then definitely come back to comment. The post they write make me pause and think in most cases. A lot of the stuff I enjoy is easy to comment on after reading and voting, but those two in-particular do cause me quite often to pause and think.

I can however see the $28, and one hour and no comment issue, I think a few, (not all), of them will open up the persons blog and take a look to see why, curiosity if nothing else. (I myself do it on new accounts I find).

As you can see 7 hours made a lot of a difference in the amount and level of the comments. It is curiosity that drives some of Hive. We just have to know why. I appreciated your views and thoughts on his post, like Asher, Taraz is one of those community nodes he speaks of.

That’s where tribes and communities come in. Also those people that envy posts like this have not realized that if they would post good content daily for 4 years, that they might surpass this with ease.

It’s all about building, and building takes time.

The get rich quickly days of hive are over, unless the price spikes above a dollar again.

I remember posts getting $200 back then. Things are a lot better now.

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I agree 100%. I do see the communities and tribes as a great way to make your mark. And with the active curation efforts by OCD, curangel etc. Great posts are being discovered.
Hive curation is very much a work in progress and it has improved over the three years since I have been here. Finding the balance between rewarding content and personalities is all part of the attention economy that will evolve over time.

Yes there is still a lot of room for improvement

Valued authors posts as community hubs. I like that thought!

One does not become such a hub overnight, as you said also, it requires a consistency of quality, engagement and interaction.

Food for thought.

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I like the concept of it too as rather than being like other social medias where there are a small number of "chosen" celebrities, there is the potential for a far greater widening on Hive. It is highly unlikely that an author on Hive is going to earn like a YouTube star, but that same value could easily be spread across a thousand nods/hubs and there could be tens of thousands of them earning pretty well, once price develops.

I get the whole thing about feeling over rewarded, sometimes it's a thing like circles we don't need to mention but someone that puts their deepest inner thoughts, wisdom and perspective or have a creative side is not what I consider over rewarded. Maybe during the time of bots yes there was abuse but I find now it's more balanced then it ever was as far as effort/reward ratio. Sure not all our posts are winners but a simple posts that generates tons of comments and engagement is as valuable as a long form text or great art, some one that comments all over but may not be the best posters are also just as valuable, a lot of things at play people don't take into consideration. I don't think anyone should feel guilty for the relationships they have built over the years and that counts for a lot since that's the social part of social media. Adding $$ value to that, there will always be push and pull and jealousy, it's the real world, we are the real world and haters gonna hate. Also the thing to remember, value is in the eye of the beholder (up-voters) and we all have different perspective on what is valuable.

The approach on the chosen topics was great, @tarazkp.

Particularly speaking, I think that the voting power (especially of whales and big projects) should be better distributed in smaller communities because that would encourage more users to post there.